someone has a 230 out of a 64 Nova for sale:

How much should I offer him?

Thanks.

I would wait for a 250 or better yet a 292 CID engine. There out there, check with the 'truck yards'.

Changing a 230 for a 194 isn't worth the time or money.

John M.......

Thanks John.

On the other hand if the motor is that good it might provide you with a nice runner while you did some rebuilding / performance mods to that 250 in your other car. When you finally do up the 250 and yank the 230 you'll end up with a complete running engine to use as another 250 rebuild ( with a 250 crank and some pistons needed ). Now you have another head that you know the conditon of, and everything else that is to know about that 230.

V8 minded guys really don't wnat an inline good or bad and would likely just toss it away until they find someone who is into inlines. Offer him no more than $100 and less if you can get away with it. There is a good chance if you don't take it off his hands then nobody will. Walk away if he rubs the price up but leave your number. Expect a phone call from him and then drop your price even lower. This is the rules of engagement when dealing with the V8 types and we usually win.

good luck,

Mike G (4355 )

Thanks Mike.

He has a 'friend' that offered him $400 bucks for it. I think I'll just give him my number like you said.

That "friend" has been at every swap meet and garage I have been to in my life. Sometimes he is known as "Another guy is interested in it". The friend must be broke or something because he never ends up buying whatever it is you are interested in, but for a guy with no money he manages to get around to all those swap meets with no problem. He also must not have access to a phone because he never calls the seller back to make the buy. He does however have things to sell but prefers to let others do the selling. When you are haggling over a price you will often hear "It isn't mine I'm selling it for a friend and he told me not to drop the price, sorry".

My guess is he lives in Pennsylvania and is a folklore hero there. They even had license plates honoring him that said on the bottom.....
YOU HAVE A FRIEND IN PENNSYLVANIA

Have a safe and happy holiday weekend,
Mike G ( 4355 )

I was wondering what part of the world you live in because I have a few extra parts and engines I would like to give away. Perry

i wondered why thy put that on our plates now i know. but you are right he does get around. did they clone him??

Hi Mike, thats what I was kinda thinking. First his said his friend offered him $400. The next day he said that he would take $300 for it. I told him I wasn't sure and then the said the price is negotiable. Do you have any idea how much I should expect to spend on the 250 crank and pistons?


Hi Perry. I live in Redlands, CA.

If you want a 250, you might want to wait until you find one. It will probably be less expensive than buying a 230 and the 250 components. If no one close to you on this board has a 250, you might put a wanted ad on Steve's Nova website saying you want to purchase a good running 74 or earlier 250 within X miles of your home. There are many on that site that replacing their inlines and would love someone to haul off their old motor.

250s are out there all over the place and of course present the simplest way to end up with a 250 - it already is one. Ending up with a half decent 230 for next to nothing and in the future acquiring a 250 crank for cheap is just another way to do it with the 230 he would already have. By then the cylinders will most likely need to be bored to make them right so whether a 230 or a 250 new pistons have to be bought for the rebuild. That leaves the only added cost being whatever a used 250 crank might cost. Crank grinding and a balance job cost the same for both.
Out here a useable 250 crank that needs a typical regrind goes anywhere from free to $50.

In the long run it usually comes down to what is around at the time and what is a freebie and what can we afford to spend for things that aren't free.

Mike G ( 4355 )

Around here a rebuildable core 250 runs $100-150 bucks. Of course there is always the occassional bargain laying in the corner of someones garage. The 250 went in about a gazillion vehicles, so they aren't hard to find.

Boo

Hey Mike, your "friend" must have a valid passport as well because I have heard about him at our flea markets up here. Hope he has a big pickup truck to carry all this stuff home....

I found this page showing hp and torque ratings for a few engines:

http://people.smu.edu/acambre/nova/engine_statistics.html

what is the cause of the huge power drop off in 72 for the 250? emissions stuff or something?

if my 194 has more power than the a '73 250, why wouldn't i stick with that? is it b/c the 250 has more potential?

That's correct, the EPA and 'SMOG' laws.

Yes; The 250 has more potential & the 292 even more, especialy for street use.

John M.....

What did they change?
What would I have to do to get the engine back up to the 67-70 155hp?

I believe GM went to net horsepower numbers from the gross numbers previously used prior to 72. I do not have the data for the different years of 250's, but I would be fairly comfortable that if the compression ratios are the same, the true power levels are very close. I do know for the V8s, that the major change in performance was due reduced compression. 73 & 74 had the most restrictive emissions; in 75 things started to get better when converters and HEI were added.

Bruce is correct. The main difference is just the way they measured the HP. As for compression, the 250s always ran around 8.5:1 except for a few engines that went to California cars; 8.2:1.

Boo

Oops, I guess I should have read further.

at the bottom of the page:

1Starting in 1972, horsepower and torque figures are SAE net. This means that they are measured at the wheels. Net HP rating is more realistic since two cars can have two different SAE net ratings but still have the same gross HP rating.

When new cars are advertised, are they showing the net numbers at the wheels?

Hey chevyII,

I've got the 250 I took out still sitting on pallet. Was thinking about building it up, but would let it go if you could arrange crating and pickup. I live in Northeast MS 38804.
-Nic

You might want to check this out. It may only be a 194, but the price is right (free)

http://stevesnovasite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21304

i found a 1979 250 for $150. the guys says it ran well when he took it out? what do you think?

250 is a good motor. Unfortunately they all say they ran well when pulled. I'd go for it and hope for the best. Chances are it'll be just fine. Good motor.

how much should i offer the guy, $100?

Some questions I would ask him.

How long has it been sitting?
What is his version of "well"?
Why'd he take it out in the first place?
Would you take $75 cash?
How many miles?
Will it need a rebuild?

thanks for the tips everyone. i'll send an email to the seller today.

On the 79, is the intake manifold part of the cylinder head or separate like your 194? If one piece, you will want to use your 194 head on it. You will also need to use your oil pan and oil pan pick-up. This engine should have a HEI distributor; if so it is worth $25-$50 by itself so keep that in mind.

On top of Jeepdudes questions, check the oil to so how nasty it is and if possible remove the valve cover to see if it is gunked up. Also check if he will help you load it or deliver it to you. Depending on your situation, that could be worth something to you.

why is the 194 head better?

It's the difference in integrated head and non-integrated head. Integrated heads have the intake integrated into the head. Sucks if you want to later add headers. I think it was '75 when they started with the integrated heads.

edited**it's the intake thats integrated.

if there is an integrated head, should i still think about this engine?

Yes, if you want to keep the stock intake and exhaust. And yes, if you can get a non-int head.

6 months ago i got 3 250's for $100. today i was just given a 230 or 250. i dont know which it is from the 60's also a bunch of other 6 stuff. a crank 3 distributors crome valve cover. and more.

That a heck of late Christmas gift! I've been looking for a good set of chrome covers side and valve....wanna sell or trade?

mite could trade i have a pair of chrome side covers too. i live in v8 area they just through the 6 away. i got another 250 and 3 speed out of an 80 truck just for taking it out.
wish some of them were 292's

Even if the 250 has the integrated head, go for it, but use it as a tool to lower the price. The 194 head has the smallest cylinder chambers of any of the late inline motors so it will give the 250 a little boost in compression. You head will bolt right on to the 250.

thanks everyone,

I sent an email to the seller yesterday with all of the questions.

here are the answers i got:
+++
How long has it been sitting? ABOUT 9 MONTHS
Why did you take it out? I'M REBUIDING A 52-FORD P/U, AND I'M GOING TO PUT A
302 IN IT.
How many miles? UN SURE.
Will it need a rebuild? RAN VERY WHEN I PULLED IT OUT, HARD TO ANSWER THIS
QUESTION.
Is the intake manifold part of the cylinder head or separate? IT IS
SEPERATE, BUT I HAVE IT. I WILL INCLUDE IT
+++

he had a 52 ford with the gm 250 6cyl, or is there a ford version? (hmmm, i think i just found this, it look likes they made them from 60-83)


How much should I offer him?

If it needs a rebuild, how much would I need to think about spending?

I also found this in the area
"6 CYLINDER eng, from 63 Chevy Nova, running when removed, comp, less air cleaner, $20" this must be another 194. Shoud I pick it up for parts?

It came out of a 52 Ford pick up? You better ask some more questions. Ford had a 144, 170, 240, 250, and of course the 300 inch engines and all were inlines. I'm not a Ford expert but I don't think any of them were around in 1952. It's possible that anyone could have put a later 250 inch Ford into that 52 and also possible they might have put a 250 inch Chevy in it as well.
People use what is laying around. I recently ran across an early 50's Dodge pick up that had a Y block Ford V8 and its tranny installed in it. Talk about an uncommon swap!

Mike G ( 4355 )

Ran very ***** what?

Offer him $50 wait a few days then offer your max.

As far as rebuilding...Would you being doing the work? Getting someone else to? or some of both.
The cost of paying someone else greatly affects the total cost of a rebuild vs. the total cost of parts.

For the $20 engine.....hmmm....go check it out....if its already pulled ready to go, I would probably give $20 for it...but if the guy only wants $20 for it, I'd be willing to bet he'd give it to you just to clear some space.

Let us know how it turns out.

Chevy2
Ask for a Photo Of the Motor We can tell which it is.

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