I was just looking over some more modern inline engines and I came across the Vortec 4200. It has some pretty serious stock HP over my 69 Chevy 250. Is there any real benefit to building the 250 over putting a Vtec 4200 in there? I'm not planning on doing this but I was just wondering. Why do people build the old engines over just putting in 2000s engines? Nostalgia? or is the price per HP better if you're building an old engine or what?

Nostalgia works but a 270 or 302 Jimmy works better. You pay more to modify them and fight for every horsepower but the satisfaction of doing it is the payday.

The 250 is very simple and easy to work on. The 4200 much more complicated to install and is computer controlled. A lot has to change in order to use it. I too would like to change to this engine when the time comes. It would be a huge project for me though, so until this current 235 wears out I will just be investigating the possibilities. At the very least my whole drive train would have to be replaced. EFI_DIY has put one of these in IIRC.

Snowman,

A lot of folks here just like to run the old iron, I did started out with a hot 292 but was not happy with it so I changed to a 4200.

If someone was to install a 4200 into a post '66 gm chassis its not that hard.

I used a '78 nova clip in my '51 gmc.


Changes needed are:

1) rear sump oil pan (now avaialble).
2) fabricated mounts but I think a LS engine mount kit is very close.
3) transmission swap - easiest is to keep the OEM 4l60e
4) install the GM electronics - this has been done many times now and the kinks have been worked out.
5) shorten the driveshaft.
6) install the OEM electronic gas pedal.
7) exhaust, and cooling hook ups.

Is it more work - yes - hard to do - depends on your skill set.
In my opinion the 4200 runs rings around the old iron. 2-3 x the HP 1/2 the fuel consumption.

As Jalopy 45 said, the satisfaction you get from building a 270 or 302 GMC is great. However, the frustration trying to get parts and the cost isn't so great.

My 321 inch (+.125 overbore) Jimmy made 347 hp on the dyno but it was harder to build than 10 small block Chevys.

308 Hudson rods (modified)
Custom JE pistons ($100 each)
Custom aluminun roller rocker arms, shafts, etc. (I built them)
3x2 sheet medal intake
Custom 4x1 Header
Etc
Etc
Etc
The 4200 engine swap sounds like a walk in the park...and cheaper.

Ron

As Marc rightly said, some of us will build and run the old iron 'cause that's what we got, and we happen to like it. We may not be the fastest there is, but we'll be fast enough, and we'll be noticed.

Had we had the 4200s in the day, we should have run 'em if we could, and even now we'll keep watch for one and something to use it in. They're quick right out of the box . . . but modiifying them, as we modify the older engines, can run into real money, as i think that Marc can testify.

God's Peace to you.

d
Inliner #1450

So then why do dragsters use carbureted old engines and why does NASCAR use carburetors?

it was harder to build

He's being modest - the really hard part is that you have to invent the whole thing yourself - there's not much background to build on.

Why carburetors?
Because otherwise you won't buy them.

Those classes use carburetors because that is what the rules require.

Yep... someone has to go first.... guess I like to cut my own path.

Agreed that modifying a 4200 isn't cheap. My guess is a'06 up 4200 with a ported head and freeflow exhaust/good tune will make 320+ HP. Cost to mod, a set of head bolts and head gasket
+ time/cutters.

Back in the day.... just reset your time reference make now "the day" to bad I'm not closer to some of the older folks here to help much beyond getting parts ready to help get the swaps done.

Are there times when I get frustrated - yep.

The old engines are built for as many reasons as there are guys still building them.
1. Because we did it when we were young
2. Because our dad, uncle, brother, etc had one
3. Because they are serious engines
4. Because they look great
5. Because they sound great
6. Because they make a lot of V8 guys blush
7. Because we have piles of them
8. Because other people throw them away
9. Because they are " traditional"
10. Because they are different
11. Because that is what came in the car
12. Because we don't know any better
13. Because we just like them
The list goes on, and then SOMEONE comes up with an engine that fits into our narrow perception of what an engine should be but because of it's newness we're out of our comfort zone. The thing makes more HP stock than any inline I've ever built, but it just doesn't look right. It gets great gas milage,but it's not a "traditional" inline. I remember in '57 looking into the engine bay of a '40 Ford sedan admiring an almost new 283 that we had just installed in my brother's friend's car. Traditional? Not in '57, except for the #1 hot rod tradition. Which is: Take something from something and put it in something to make it do something you want done better. You can substitute any of the "somethings" for something else.
I only know two guys that have used 4.2s, Marc and Danny. I haven't had a ride in either pickup yet. Here are some old pics of Danny's 4200 . You can see the mods he did to the crossmember. Marc's new pan would have fixed that. It takes up all the under hood space. Most people looking at it don't know what it is. These are old shots. It's much cleaner now. The rest of our members have a tough time keeping up on cruises, especially when Danny passes a gas station. Traditional? You bet! The worst thing. their numbers are limited. Beater

quote=Beater of the Pack] The thing makes more HP stock than any inline I've ever built, but it just doesn't look right. <<<< just different...


Marc's new pan would have fixed that. It takes up all the under hood space. Most people looking at it don't know what it is. <<<

That is one thing I get asked all the time - guys go away scratching their heads... then when they see it "go" their mouths go into fly catching mode...

Traditional? You bet! The worst thing. their numbers are limited. Beater [/quote]

I know little to nothing about a Jimmy, but the satisfaction that comes from turning an original, 40 yr old grocery getter into 'hot' street ride is more than worth it.

3 or 4 times someone has asked me if we have a big block or small block in our truck, and I tell them a small block (250 STD). What they don't know won't hurt them, and they can't tell the difference either when they see 2 10" wide rubber marks on the parking lot (through the 1st & 2nd gear).

Would a 4200 from a Trailblazer be hotter? I'm sure, but Snowman, I'd love to own your Skylark - it's a great car, make it into a true sleeper.