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Cool, I'll give that a try when I finish reassembling the cooling system. I've been busy detailing the engine bay, and just now getting everything back together.

Ok, so there have been three different valve covers for the Chevy L6, and two types of integrated head with minor differences. Good to know why shopping for a valve cover for a non-integrated head so I don't end up with the wrong one.

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Still cleaning and detailing all the parts I have access to. I installed the new coolant and windshield washer bottles too. Plugs and valve cover are back on. I've decided while I have the '78 radiator hoses off, I should just replace them just in case. I was already replacing the heater hoses. I still have some of the original tower style hose clamps, but I have no idea how to tighten these. I did break a bolt on the water pump while reinstalling it, but it didn't snap until I took it out again so I don't need to retap it. Gotta wait to get replacement bolts after the hardware store opens after Easter Sunday.





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Looks nice. Wish I could get a new overflow bottle for the Nova. Asfar as I know none are made. We got a better bottle out of the junkyard for $5. Haven't installed it yet, still working on cleaning the inside of the junkyard find. Where did you get the new bottles for the Camaro? Jay 6155

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 Originally Posted By: intergrated j 78
Looks nice. Wish I could get a new overflow bottle for the Nova. Asfar as I know none are made. We got a better bottle out of the junkyard for $5. Haven't installed it yet, still working on cleaning the inside of the junkyard find. Where did you get the new bottles for the Camaro? Jay 6155


I got them from Fbody Warehouse. I haven't ordered from them in awhile, and just went to their site and get an error message. I hope they didn't go out of business. Their last tech video was uploaded a year ago:

https://www.youtube.com/user/Fbodywarehouse1/videos

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdIlyskfR_Q

Last edited by Lifeguard; 04/21/14 09:49 AM.
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For some reason now I can get into the site. Must have been a glitch:

http://www.fbodywarehouse.com/fbw/home.php?cat=364

http://www.fbodywarehouse.com/fbw/home.php?cat=355

My coolant bottle that was in my Camaro when I bought it (I presume factory original) didn't have the vented cap they offer, it had the same cap as the bottle came with. My washer bottle also didn't have the cap mounted hose connector, it came out of the bottom from the motor.

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I noticed they did not have the pump for the bottle. It looks like I got that from Camaro Cental:

http://www.camarocentral.com/SearchResults.asp?Search=windshield+washer+pump

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Well I've got upper and lower radiator hoses coming on Wednesday, and I bought all new bolts for the water pump today. I've installed the pump and took the bolts down to snug and then some since I can't really find a torque spec for them anywhere.

So while I'm waiting for hoses, I assembled everything that could be be put together. Hoses, pulleys, air cleaner, and I installed brand new heater hoses. I'm using newer style hose clamps, because I can't figure out how to tighten the vintage tower clamps. The heater hoses came extra long, so I routed them around onto the wheel well versus the old hoses which were cut down and running right alongside the HEI and straight back to the heater core.

I'm now working on the electric fan installation. Trying to find a switched electric signal to hook the relay up to.

Here's a few pics I snapped with only the radiator, fan, hoses and bracket left to go:






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 Originally Posted By: intergrated j 78
Did a little research on Z28 exhaust:
42566 y pipe 67.99
21598 muffler 42.99 each.
43744 and 43745 are 24.79 each
43662 39.79
43663 33.99
There are other pipes listed for "earler" versions of this system at about the same price. The 21907 muffler that you have posted about is the stock 1 pipe in and 2 pipe out for Camaros and Novas of that era. When the Z28 came back out in 1977, I bought one. ( I was only 2 yrs old at the time) This exhaust system was the only real change to the engine, the rest of the engine was stock LM1. The exhaust added ~20 hp over the system that you posted parts for. At the time I took 2 stock exhaust pipes from a Chevelle and ran them from the manifolds to the mufflers,getting rid of both y pipes and the converter. Believe it or not they fit perfectly and I ended up with a true dual exhaust system. I would recomend that you buy the Z28 system starting at the y pipe and have the shop make you a 1 piece 2 1/2 pipe to crossover and hook up to the y pipe. The shop may even be able to get the pipes cheaper than you can. At the very least get the y pipe and go from there. I have been told that the 292 manifold outlet is in the same place as our 1bbl intergrated head. If someone could verify this (TLowe?) then everything would bolt up when the head was changed to non intergrated. Jay 6155


With the cooling system finished this week, my next project may be moving along to the ignition system and upgrading the coil, cap/rotor, and plug wires. But I'm thinking about the exhaust and maybe trying the Z28 cat-back setup. Attaching it to my existing 2.25" header pipe like was suggested with a pipe going from 2.25" with adapter to the 2.5" on the Y-pipe. Then when I make the exhaust manifold swap to the 292 HD 2.5" one, I can just hook the 2.25" header pipe to it and get it running down to the exhaust shop to replace everything from the Y-pipe forward with 2.5".

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Here's a few pics of the '77-'81 Z28 exhaust from my assembly manual. The 2.25" intermediate pipe coming out of the resonator and the 2.25" tailpipe are actually one continuous pipe from the factory. I also noticed that the assembly manual calls for painting the pipe from the hanger on back with a black high temp paint. The L6 and other V8 exhaust plans don't call for the painting of the tailpipes. Probably done on the Z28 to match all the black trim and look good when you put chrome tailpipe covers on it.




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Here's some pictures of the fan install. I went with an Imperial 16" fan, which covered more of the radiator surface but ended up having a dimple that interfered with the the water pump pulley. Since it was already set up as a pusher out of the box, and I had plenty of room in front, I decided to front mount it instead. Looking at the specs, the 10" and 14" Imperial fans should be able to mount behind the radiator and can be flipped to turn them into puller fans.





I got a relay kit to go with the fan and set up the sensor a few inches below the top hose inlet:



And mounted the relay using an existing hole in the front radiator support right next the passenger side of the radiator and battery:


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I also took a few snapshots with the radiator bracket and hoses in place. You really can't see if the belt driven fan is present or not with the top cover bracket in place.







Hmmmm....air cleaner and radiator cover are still a bit dirty after I washed last night. Better sponge them off to look good with all the other newly painted parts.

Last edited by Lifeguard; 04/23/14 08:29 PM.
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I've been pricing the Z28 exhaust to see what is most affordable. I've got a 20% off I got from Advanced that's good for another 3 days. So I priced the resonator back system from both Rockauto and Advanced. Rockauto is cheaper, but there was extra for shipping while Advanced offered free shipping over $75. I broke down the prices to see which combo was the cheapest overall:

Pipes & hangers: Rockauto: $165.69 Advanced: $155.15
Resonators & clamps: Rockauto: $100.06 Advanced: $129.89
Y-pipe: Amazon: $75.79

I think I'm going to get the pipes and hangers from Advanced now and use the driver side tailpipe that I can hook to my pipe I added to the current muffler position. Then I can get the resonators from Rockauto later, when I can also order the Y-pipe from Amazon and I can have my shop connect it all. I won't need the clamps at that time, because my shop will weld the pipes all up, cut the bracket off the Y-pipe and make a custom pipe from my 2.25" head pipe to the 2.5" Y-pipe flange. Should all be done by summer, and then I'll move on to the ignition system.

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I really like the way that you cleaned and detailed the underhood and engine.I think the Z28 system will be great on that Camaro. Shop around more for the Y pipe I think that I saw it cheaper but can't rember where. Jay 6155

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Thanks. I've been googling the hell out of it, but $75 is the best I've seen with shipping. I'll definitely keep checking for sales and jump when I see one extra cheap. Grocery shopping took priority, so I'm just getting the driver side pipes for now, and hook it up to what I got now. Then using my $25 coupon from Advanced to get the other half before the end of the month.

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New water pump has no leaks, so I put in new coolant and the new electric fan is working great. It's not as noisy at idle without the belt driven fan, but the belts and alternator are still a little noisy.

I've been trying to get the low idle adjusted to properly tune it up all day, and I've had little success with it. Don't know what I'm doing wrong. When warm the engine doesn't want to start without revving it and doesn't like to take idle, and I'd like to fix that. Cold starts are pretty hard, and it dies in idle until it is warmed up too. I'll review the instructions again and try early tomorrow to get it adjusted.

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Give it a little more timing.


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65 Chevelle Wagon and 41 Hudson Pickup
Information and parts www.12bolt.com

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 Originally Posted By: tlowe #1716
Give it a little more timing.


More than 6 degrees BTDC? That's the factory recommendation, but I'll give that a try after I use some of integrated's suggestions. Thanks.

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I followed Jay's instructions and was able to get the low idle tuned. I took it out for a drive, then came back and checked to make sure it was still idling at 800rpm. Then tightened the adjustment hex screw all the way in and disconnected the wire to the solenoid, and it stayed running. Then I backed it out until it hit a stumbling 425 rpm, then plugged it back in and it leapt right up to 800rpm again. Then did a few half turns of the idle mixture screw until it stopped raising rpm (about one turn away from the screw backing all the way out) and back in a half turn. Then repeated with the solenoid again. It's not exactly stock idle smooth, still stumbles a little bit on idle, but it's the best I've gotten out of it.

In the meantime I found out the instructions of my electric fan were wrong, it is a puller out of the box, not a pusher. So I need to take the fan apart and reverse the blades. Back to the parts store to get new zip fasteners for it.

Also had the back end up on ramps and rolled under with an adjustable wrench, hammer and a can of PB Blaster. After some soaking, banging and wrenching; I got the two brackets off that held the last pieces of the muffler in place. I got a 35% off deal from Advanced, so my brackets and tailpipes are on the way. The resonators were still cheaper thru Rockauto, so I'm waiting on ordering those for the paycheck after Memorial Day. In the meantime, I'm going to try to hook up the driver side tailpipe to the muffler and 2.25" pipe I added to it. Hopefully I can stabilize that muffler and keep it from banging against the floor pan (which is annoying) in the meantime. I ordered the hangers for the stock muffler, which I realized will fit the tailpipes too: 35358 and 35183. That way there will be two attachments on the tailpipe to hold it in place even if it's not hooked up to the rest of the exhaust.

Still deciding on whether I will go with single slanted chrome tips on the tailpipes, or go with the dual side by side outlet tips?

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My driver side tailpipe and hangers arrived yesterday. I still need to get some bolts for the hangers from the hardware store. I did put the Z28 detail of painting the tailpipe with black header paint. The tailpipe outlet is cut at an angle, but not like the stock chevy pipe which is a greater angle and leaves a flat bit at the end. I'm putting a chrome exhaust tip on it anyway, so I'm leaving it as is.






I should also mention that these two pipes are actually one piece when installed at the factory. But Walker by offering the 2.25" tailpipe end separately, makes it easier for people to upgrade with a transverse muffler and dual 2.25" tailpipes over the stock 2" tailpipes.

Last edited by Lifeguard; 05/08/14 03:00 PM.
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Snapped some shots as I assembled my Z28 driver side tailpipe. Here's the bracket that attaches to the frame to hang the tailpipe from:



And the tailpipe attached on the driver's side:


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Then I used the stock mounting points for the L6 transverse muffler to mount the muffler hangers:









Last edited by Lifeguard; 05/10/14 09:50 PM.
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There is an L bracket that slips into the mounts and attaches to a U-bolt to hold the pipe in place on the muffler, I just used two of these for both tailpipes. The brackets were for a 2" clamp, so I drilled it out to accept the 2.25" clamp:






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So the tailpipe in place, it was just a matter of hooking the muffler attached to the 2.25" stock L6 header pipe up to the tailpipe:





So I added four 60* angle pipes to run from muffler to tailpipe for a temporary solution until I can afford to finish off the dual resonator setup and get a custom connection between the header pipe and the Y-pipe.


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I think just a short piece of pipe and that would be out the side like stock it I did that on my nova. Jay 6155

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Drove around 60 miles today in the Camaro. Tailpipe rubs on the quarter panel on and off, which sounds nasty......back under to do some adjustments to center it between the leaf spring and the panel. Still having a rough time getting started with a cold engine until it hits temperature. I'm going to try a little more timing and see if that helps.

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 Originally Posted By: tlowe #1716
Give it a little more timing.


OK, I've given it an extra two degrees of initial timing from 6* factory recommendation to 8*. We'll see if that helps out on cold starts and initial warm up. Test driving it warmed up around the block seemed to have a little more get up and go to it.

I readjusted the solenoid idle to 800rpm and the low idle screw to about 450rpm before it wanted to stop. When adjusting the solenoid for idle, should the low screw be tightened all the way each time before setting the normal idle? I did it without tightening the screw down, and it took a lot to get to 800rpm, then when I set the screw it stayed at the low idle. Then I tried it by tightening the screw first and then set the idle, before setting the low idle and that worked. It was too damn hot in that area to try setting the mixture screw again after the idle. So I'll do that later.

Now I'm going to fiddle with the tailpipe to center it so it doesn't rub.

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Fixed the tailpipe rub, but the muffler still keeps hitting the floor pan. Will fix that when exhaust is done.

Idle is a tiny bit rough, not stock smooth, which is odd because other then the exhaust it is a stock engine. Starts cold no problem. And occasional stutter at times, with no consistency to it.

I'm wondering if even in its stock configuration, I shouldn't get some new springs for the HEI centrifugal advance and tune it to bring the advance in sooner?

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The centrifugal advance mechanism is probably stuck & or really sticky & does not work.

Would need to clean it up & reapply grease to the affected components.

A spring & weight kit always helps.

MBHD


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 Originally Posted By: Mean buzzen half dozen A.K.A. Hank
The centrifugal advance mechanism is probably stuck & or really sticky & does not work.

Would need to clean it up & reapply grease to the affected components.

A spring & weight kit always helps.

MBHD


Yeah, I was starting to think that too after reading up on adjusting centrifugal and vacuum advance, and reading how it gets gummed up over time. I guess a little HEI disassembly is in order. I wish I had some cash to to get a new cap and rotor to swap out too. Hopefully Memorial Day weekend will be a windfall, and I can just invest in finishing off the exhaust and ignition updates all at once.

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I reread Santucci's chapter on ignition, it's a short one. He was recommending for "street/mild strip" 10* initial advance with full advance at 3k rpm, and total timing at 32*-38*. He also suggests widening spark plug gap to between 0.050" and 0.080". I'd like to achieve maximum mpg in this stock configuration, so I wonder how much I should deviate from the factory recommendations?

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You'll have to pick either economy or performance and tune for one of them. Trying to maximize for economy isn't going to provide the maximum performance and vice versa. When it comes to timing, that is one of those areas where it should be best said, "That your results will vary!" To try and give a blanket statement that will apply to a large majority of applications isn't realistic. You'll just have to tinker with your combo because too many variables are going to affect it from external conditions like outside temp and quality of gas you run, to internal engine components like camshaft, carb and other engine mods and how well they interact together. Its just difficult for achieving optimum economy to expect optimum performance to exist at the same time.



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As long as the mono jet, integrated head and cam are still on the engine, I might as well tune for economy. Once I do a top end swap, then I can tune for performance. I'm using it as a daily driver until we replace the 4wd SUV that was totaled last winter, so easy on fuel would be nice at this point. So just keep trying different combinations of advance and check against miles at each fill-up to see which works best, keeping notes on all of them?

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You could also see gain/lose from plug gap as well, so a lot of things to test out and try.



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 Originally Posted By: CNC-Dude #5585
You could also see gain/lose from plug gap as well, so a lot of things to test out and try.


Yeah, 4 variables to adjust. That creates a lot of combinations.

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Tlowe got 20+ MPG on a pretty mild 250 build with a 2 bbl in a Chevy II wagon. So a lot can be gained by tinkering.



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 Originally Posted By: CNC-Dude #5585
Tlowe got 20+ MPG on a pretty mild 250 build with a 2 bbl in a Chevy II wagon. So a lot can be gained by tinkering.


I mentioned earlier in the thread that 1978 was the first year for EPA mileage listings and the '78 Camaro L6 was rated 18mpg in the city and 28mpg on the highway, with an average of 21mpg. I checked mine two years ago and it was about 16mpg with half the exhaust and no tuning in city driving. That's with a 3speed manual and 2.73:1 open rear end. Integrated-J-78 said he was able to get 23.5mpg on mostly highway. I think I'll get a highway route from a gas station going out to an ice cream shop and back to the same gas station again, and use that to measure best fuel economy along with a drive with the wife for a treat once a week.

I already have new plugs indexed and gapped to factory recommendation. So I'll clean up the HEI, add a new cap and rotor, and 8mm wires. Then put a timing tape on the balancer and reuse the 36 year old springs and see what the factory vacuum and centrifugal advance are at and have a baseline to work from. Then I can start playing with different advance combos and see how it changes. It will be an all summer job, but I probably can't afford a top end swap until next year anyway.

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Just counting the years in my head and I realized I haven't had a carbureted and HEI engine since summer of 1990, and that was an Olds Delta 88 with an Olds 350 in it that my Grandfather gave me (used car salesman). I had two '76 Camaros prior to that with small block Chevys. Every other car or truck of mine since then has been computer controlled fuel injection. Now I'm back to my roots.

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Opened up the top of my HEI to see what it looks like. Pretty clean with some surface rust on the parts of the centrifugal advance. The bushings look tight. I took the advance apart and cleaned the parts a little. The advance turns out but seems sluggish coming back, not very snappy. There's a tiny bit of up and down play on the shaft, I don't know how much until I remove and measure it. The vacuum advance says 19-24 on it. I don't know why it has a range? I think the distributor just needs to be taken apart and cleaned.

I'm thinking about replacing parts with these two kits:
Accel 31035 adjustable vacuum advance
Accel 31041 advance curve kit for HEI w/ vacuum

Will those work with the L6 HEI?

The other parts I'm going to be swapping out when I can afford it:
Accel 8129 Cap & rotor
Accel 4021 8mm SS plug wires
Accel 140003 Supercoil

I'm not sure about the Accel 35361 module? I've read that replacing the stock module on a stock/street build doesn't make any difference. Then again, having new parts can't hurt.

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Just as I thought, the advance is not working & the original grease is all gummed up. Need to take apart the shaft clean, grease & reassemble.

If the advance kits are for a SBC, those will work.

It's always good to have an extra module just in case. Stock one works the same.
I used to go to junkyards just to have spares.
Accel super coil ,good.

Any cap with brass terminals are usually better than stock.
Accel products are usually OK, but there are better IMO.
http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/bwd-s...distributer+cap
Sorry wrong style,
http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/bwd-s...distributor+cap

MBHD


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 Originally Posted By: Mean buzzen half dozen A.K.A. Hank
Just as I thought, the advance is not working & the original grease is all gummed up. Need to take apart the shaft clean, grease & reassemble.

If the advance kits are for a SBC, those will work.

It's always good to have an extra module just in case. Stock one works the same.
I used to go to junkyards just to have spares.
Accel super coil ,good.

Any cap with brass terminals are usually better than stock.
Accel products are usually OK, but there are better IMO.
http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/bwd-s...distributer+cap
Sorry wrong style,
http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/bwd-s...distributor+cap

MBHD


Yeah, taking it out and cleaning over the weekend. I'll see if I need to shim it when I check it. Is the distributor shaft greased with motor oil?

I'm most familiar with the Accel parts, that's what a lot of people were using from what I recall during the '80s. The Accel tan and Supercoil gray with yellow wires is period correct for aftermarket parts. So that's why I was thinking about them if I have to deviate to any color other than stock black and gray.

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