Inliners International Forums General Discussion Engines Engine application ID

F11051AB is the stamped umber on my block ad am trying to figure out the original application.

Hi Ric . . .

This topic comes up all the time here: Inliners post circa '11

The Nova Resources page can help you decode that Engine Application Number. I think that you will need to re-check that 'AB' suffix though - as that decodes to '69 four cylinder . . .

regards,
stock49

I now think it is F1105TAB

It's an '80 or '81 something

The data over at 73-87 suggests certain 73 truck applications carried a TAB suffix.

Does this have an integral intake head on it? Could be a franken-motor . . .

It does have integrated head

A two-barrel integrated head was used in trucks from '75 to '84 . . . so my guess is that someone with a later truck ran into trouble on the bottom end - and swapped the short-block from a '73 to get back on the road . . .

I know there was a 250 integrated head with it's own valve cover in 1975 and 1976. And then there was the 250 integrated head I have in 1977 and 1978. Both of these are Monojet heads. In 1979 they went back to a non-integrated head for the last year of the inline six in Camaros, Novas, and Caprices. But I'm not sure what years the truck 250 used with the Varajet head? Was it introduced in 1979 and used until the truck 250 was retired after 1984? Or did trucks go back to a non-integrated Monojet head in 1978, and then changed to the Varajet in 1980?

AFAIK the integral two-barrel head was designed for trucks and the mono-jet head was used exclusively on cars . . .
regardless I think Ric has a frankenmotor on his hands. A '73 block did not leave a GM factory with an integrated head.

Are you saying that the '75 to '76 trucks, and '77 to '78 trucks continued to used the non-integrated heads on the 250? Because the trucks were using the Monojet during those years, and I was under the impression that the 250 trucks used the same head as the 250 cars? The Carb Doctor lists the Varajet as being used from 1979 to 1987. But I wondered if that meant it was used on the 1979 model year trucks, or it was introduced in 1979 on 1980 models? The 1979 Camaro, Nova, and Caprice with 250 seems to have used the top end off the SD truck 292 (non-integrated head with 210cfm Monojet and 2.25" exhaust manifold).

Not at all. The post is about engine identification and "what the engine is out of". And given the fact that the Varajet didn't make the scene until '79 then Ric has a '73 short block with a later head.

And I see a typo up above - I meant '79 not '75. I read somewhere that the 2 barrel integrated with a varajet was created with the RPO LE3 truck application in mind - even though the varajet was used elsewhere.

I was under the impression that all 250's after '75 were integrated heads (cause of smog requirements) - and that all 79-84 trucks with a 250 were LE3 equipped.

Yeah, I see the '79 in that chart you linked to. Maybe that answers my question, '79 to '84 250 trucks were all topped with the Varajet integrated head.

The '75 and '76 had the first version of the integrated Monojet head, and the '77 and '78 had the second version of it which is what I have. But in '79, all their restyled models could only take V6s. The only hanger ons with the large hood length were the Camaro, it's sister car the Nova, and the Caprice. So they went one more year with an L6 in them. Word is they had too many warranty claims for cracked heads with the integrated, so they just slapped the non-integrated back on for the last year, apparently while they went to the Varajet head in the truck 250. Might have been a supply issue too, they weren't casting new Monojet heads, so they just reached into inventory and put the top end of the 292 truck engine on them to make it one more year in three models.

Yep - those short nosed Malibu/El Caminos:

all got that poorly engineered hack-saw V6 - essentially a 350 with the back cylinders whacked off.

Interestingly the other divisions didn't make it to '79. Pontiac dropped the 250 with the Ventura after '77 introducing the Phoenix in '77. The Phoenix, Olds Omega and Buick Apollo all sported the Buick 231 V6 . . . some as early as '75.

Yeah, the price point on Chevy's at economy end of the GM market may have been why they kept the inlines for so long. Even tho the '80-'81 Camaro could still fit the inline, as well as the Caprice through '90, they likely needed to go with a V6 to reduce the number of engines they had to put through emissions certification for cars. End of the line.

There were two. The 238/258 Buick V6 that everyone remembers and the Chevy 3.8 that was essentially a 6 cylinder version of the Chevy small block. It was a 90 degree V6 with an odd, offset ground crankshaft that gave it a smoother idle than the Buick odd fire V6. The crankshafts were weak and it still idled a little rough.

I had two of these, one in an '80 Malibu Classic and one in a '79 Malibu wagon. Both played out prematurely. I replaced the one in the '80 with a bored out 454. It was IMPRESSIVE! 400 turbo trans and a 12 bolt out of a Camaro. Really IMPRESSIVE!! The wagon got a 350 small block with a 700R4. It was a great driver. You couldn't stuff an inline six in either of them without hacking all the way back through the dashboard.

Those cars were just made for a V8!!

Yeah, that was supposition is that everything else was using either a Buick or Chevy V6, either because they were the other brands or because they were a Chevy with a short hood line and had to. So even tho the Camaro and Caprice (Nova was discontinued) could take an inline six in '80 and '81 (longer with the Caprice), it wasn't worth the cost of going through federal and California certification for just two applications. So ended the car 250. Trucks continued to use the 250 and 292 because they didn't have to go through that process yet and could have more variety in their engines.

To summarize the changes to the 250 over the years, unless you have a Franken-motor:


If you have a 250 with a non-integrated head, with a separate intake manifold, it is likely a 1974 or earlier car or truck 250. But it could be a 250 out a 1979 Camaro, Nova, or Caprice. If it still has the original engine paint, the 1974 and earlier were Chevy engine orange and the 1979 was GM Corporate Blue (a robin's egg blue, not the Chrysler blue they sell in the spray cans marked GM). I don't know if they 1979 valve cover was different from the earlier one? The main difference is the exhaust manifold, as the early motors had and angled 2" outlet while the 1979 had the exhaust manifold off the SD truck 292 which point down and was 2.25":




In 1975 and 1976 cars and trucks, they introduced the integrated Monojet head (along with the catalytic converter in cars). I don't have any real good pics of the head itself, only this one below. The engines were Chevy orange and had an exhaust manifold with a 2.25" outlet that pointed down for the pipe to run under the oil pan to the passenger side (it might be the same exhaust manifold as the 1977 and 1978 integrated). The valve cover is unique as it has an extended portion at the base that covers an additional oil gallery on the driver's side:




The 1977 and 1978 used a second version of the integrated Monojet head. Sometime during 1977 they switched from Chevy Orange to GM blue. The valve cover is similar to the earlier integrated one, but now lacks the side extension. The replacement valve cover gasket that Felpro offers for both these heads is made of cork and has the side bit for '75-'76 which you cut off to fit the '77-'78, so bolt pattern is the same (this one is mine of course):



[img]http://i.imgur.com/E7tjdva.jpg?1[/img]


This in 1979 to 1984 250 trucks they introduced the Varajet heat with its unique two barrel integrated manifold. It was GM Corporate blue until they introduced the engine black, which I think was '83 or '84? I'm not sure what the bolt pattern on the valve cover was like. It also had a unique exhaust manifold that had dual 2" outlets, although it was all one manifold inside and out. The factory exhaust actually just went a little ways and had a Y pipe into a single exhaust.



[img]http://i.imgur.com/4zf0574.jpg?1[/img]

Another make that clung to the 250 is the often forgotten Checker

They started off running Continental power and then switched to Chevy exclusively in '65. Not sure about the percentage of production that was I6 versus V8 as they shipped both.

What was the last year Checker used the Chevy inline six? Was the phase in of emissions controls different for the cabs than the regular cars? I'm curious now, I may have to find a Checker website.

Looks like the Checker Marathon only used the 230 from 1965 to 1968, and then the 250 from 1969 to 1979. Same final year as the Camaro, Nova, and Caprice. Oddly it lists a 2bbl carb from 1969 to 1975, and having a "single carb" from 1976 to 1979? I'm not sure if that means the Monojet for the last 4 years or what, but that does somewhat coincide with the integrated head engines. I once saw a pic of a cast iron 2bbl intake that was supposed to be a Chevy, and never knew what to make of that, maybe it was made for the Checker Marathon?

With all due respect wikipedia is not always a stickler for details when it comes to cars.

I have been trolling through content over at the old Checker Cab Club site. Their home page is offline but cached links to .pdf content are still hot (thank you google). Here's a brochure for the '69 A12-E which calls out a 2 barrel carb on the optional 350 V8. The 250 just lists a downdraft carb . . .

Wikipedia doesn't pre-screen new articles, or amendments/corrections to existing. Someone on their staff (of uncertain competence in my experience) will review any changes you make.
Probably outcome: rejected, "you must cite your sources", because:
1. you can't possibly be an expert
2. they have no idea what you're talking about

Some of their stovebolt stuff is mine.

Try a few articles, many contain obvious errors, I corrected over 50 on older Harley-Davidsons.

The only thing that has made me think there might have been a two barrel non-integrated engine is this pic I found online in the past. I have no idea what this mystery manifold is?

All the paint burned away from the carb pad may indicate it was fabbed up.

That's what the post at 67-72 Chevy Trucks indicates. Home made for racing.

Ah, I never knew where the image came from. I think I did a Google image search on aftermarket inline intake manifolds eons ago, and saved the image along with others for reference. Always left me scratching my head.

That's how I found it. I did an image search on "250 Chevrolet 2 barrel intake manifold". When I found the image in question I clicked on it. This brings it into 'focus' with a black background and information about the image source off to the right. Clicking the "visit page" button takes one right to the post.