Inliners International Forums General Discussion Truck Talk 1940 Chevrolet Coupe Build!

Drive train is all put together to present to the Senior Project boards. Looks great, made my speech this evening and I think it turned out well! Still doesn't run though. Haha, I was able to work my way around that slight detail. Again, the motor was my Senior Project (Exit project required to graduate) for highschool. To wrap it up, each student had to present their project to a board of judges.



Thanks!

Pete

My, but that chassis and drivetrain surely look good!

No radiator or electrics, so of course you couldn't make it "run" for your teachers. We may hope that driveshaft angle is less steep when the body is on and all of the other pieces are added.

It gets an A- for "pretty," but "pretty is as pretty does." When it runs, we could hope for an A+ for an impressive accomplishment.

Surely you have learned a lot -- and you have learned something about how much more you have to learn. That is the best education. You will never have cause to regret it.

God's Peace to you.

d
Inliner #1450

Pete, I am impressed. You two are kicking butt on this thing. It really looks good. Work around the place here is keeping me away from my roadster.

Don 1450: Thank you so much. Yeah, there was a little left to be done to get it running, but it didn't make too much of a difference to the judges whether it did or it didn't. Haha, I just never brought it up!

About the driveline; we probably are going to end up taking that mount back out and cutting it down. It's way too high. We could probably bring it down another inch before it hits the emergency brake setup. If we move the handbrake linkage to the underside we may be able to get another inch out of it. That should help, but it can't really come down too far without cutting up the frame. We'll get it as low as possible and take it from there. I just hope we'll be able to keep the frame intact!

I have learned so much. I've never been into the real bowels of a motor before. I've done a few junk yard, fixer-uper projects, but nothing as major as this. There is always something to learn, no matter age nor profession, race, gender, anything. There is always something to learn. Out of everything, that's the biggest lesson this project has taught me.

"The more one knows, the more one knows one doesn't know."

Beater: Haha! That picture is hilarious! Thank you. That Northern Nevada country is sure pretty.

More to come soon, things are going to slow down a bit over the next week or so. Final Exams are fast approaching and I've got some studying to do.

Thanks!

Pete

My goodness, what a relief!

270 GMC Video

Pete

The first start is always exciting and rewarding. Cool!

Sounds great! Remember you need to set it up to run 20 minutes at 2,000 rpm to break in the cam before you do too many little runs. That thing is going to be fun to drive.

Thanks guys!

Thank you Beater, I was wondering about that.

Started work on the cooling system. Space was going to be an issue. Also found a nice big crack in the stock 270 water pump. (See attached) Must have happened when we torqued it down. Anywho, we were going to have to ding around with the radiator to get it to fit anyway, so I grabbed water pump off the 216 Chevy that came out of the origional car. It had no end play and plenty of resistance signifying that it was not worn out. It bolted right up and was about an inch shorter - good deal! It's still a little tight for me, so I'm going to try to get the radiator inside of the housing. That should give about another inch. Might be able to get the fan in too. Also sandblasted and painted the new/old Chevy water pump. More to come tomorrow!





Thanks!

Pete

Water pump is on. We dinged around with the radiator housing trying to get the radiator further foreward so we could get the fan on but after a few hours, we decided just to get an electric fan and mount it on the front side. We would probably have ended up needing one even with the stock fan anyway. More on that later. Overall, a pretty useless day...



Thanks!

Pete

A few years back I made some pulley changes to fit a new balancer on my 270. The fan would not fit but I had no heating issues until late summer making the long slow climb to home. I added a front mounted electric pusher fan and began having heating problems all over the place. The fan was more of a restriction than a help. I had to go back to the stock balancer. I'd try very hard to move the radiator forward 1 1/2". I think I remember a problem with 216 water pumps too but I can't remember what it is. Being old is crap! But not as bad as being dead.

Consider using an electric water pump. These are cheap & give better cooling & more space behind radiator.

We put the radiator on and fired it up today! Tuned it up and let it run. The radiator sprung a leak, and the water pump had a bad seal, so all the water ran out of it and overheated. That kind of put the kybosh on things for today. Also, I think the mains I put in the carburetors are too small. I also might try my hand at making a set of adjustable mains. Some of these Zeniths had them and I've seen sets that people have made, so I figure I'll give it a shot. Any advice is much appreciated.

About the waterpump: Do the problems with the 216 pump have to do with the bearings? The bearings in the 270 are a little further away from the point of tension from the fan belt, so the torque may be less causing the bearings to last longer. Any lightbulbs go off?

ccjowett: Maybe you can enlighten me. I just read an article saying that the electric pumps typically don't pump more water. The reason for their appeal is the horsepower gains and the ability to not pump water when the engine does not need it. I was also unable to find one that would fit. I hate to argue, maybe you can prove me wrong.



Thanks!

Pete

Hi,

Some oddball reasons for overheating when everything in the
system looks good: At idle only overheat, waterpump turns too
slow.....cause is w/p pulley is too large...

Overheat at speed, air is being pushed from engine compartment
around the sides of the radiator and back thru the core. The
air just keeps getting heated and reheated and the coolant gets
cooked.. You slow down to 30 mph or less and the engine cools
down.

Again, these overheat conditions are very uncommon but always
overlooked.

It's possible if the core isn't sealed to the bulkhead, but for any OEM installation the fan can be completely removed above 35 mph.
My sister borrowed her boyfriend's car (Mustang L4, 4-speed) for some errands in Jacksonville. After a while it started to run hot, so she pulls into a station.
The "mechanic" pops the hood and tells her the problem - "hey, lady - your fan came off".
Boyfriend removed it, since he never drives the car in traffic, and never told her.

BTW: lest you think he's just some local grease monkey - he's Racer Walsh.

Melon: Good points! I'm just going to hook up a large electric, thermostat-regulated, fan and cross my fingers. I hope everything works out. There is plenty of room for the air to flow out, so hopefully that keeps the hot-air-recycling problem to a minimum. Also, the pully on the 216 pump that I'm hooking up is smaller than the origional 270 pump. All the innards are the same, so that's a plus! Thanks Melon! Cool Jeep!

Panic: Haha, good story! That's comforting. Well, I guess I'll just put a single fan on it and make sure that it does not cause too much of a block infront of the radiator so once I do get above 35mph than things will run smoothly. The local autoparts store's got a good selection. Thanks Panic!

Today was fairly productive. Grandpa spent the day bondo-ing. Everything that needs to be covered is covered. Most things are sanded down to within tolerance for blocking primer and such. Thanks grandpa! I spent most of the day drilling out broken off bolts on the underside of the body. Amost every single bolt which holds the body to the frame and the running boards to the body were broken off. It was a long day.



Thanks!

Pete

More bondo work. The body is coming along nicely. Should be moving on to blocking primer shortly. Also, we tried our hand at fiberglassing. Grandpa wanted to give it a shot, so we did. There goes our '50's technology virginity. I think it turned out alright. I'll need to paint over it because wherever there was a hole, there is a big transparent spot - it looks kinda weird.







Thanks!

Pete

Water pump is here, 3/8 pulley is installed and whole thing is painted! Hopefully the 3rd time's a charm! Electric Cooling Fan is ordered! (More on that after we pick it up.)



Thanks!

Pete

he Mechanical Water Pump is one of the last mechanical components of the modern engine which has long been considered an inefficient component that was designed as an accessory from the ever first engines. A mechanical belt driven pump installed on your car engines runs at the same speed as the engine regardless of how hot the engine is. Example: when travelling at high speeds down the freeway, the engine require less cooling as ram air is naturally cooling the engine however, the engine speed is high as is the mechanical water pump thus providing excessive cooling whilst draining the engine of power. Then in heavy traffic in high ambient, the engine is idling or slow and so is the belt driven mechanical pump, even though in this condition, extra coolant flow is required to cool the engine.

With an EWP and a digital controller, the speed of the pump is managed by the controller, which varies the supply voltage to the pump and so varies the speed of the pump, hunting for a target temperature. When the engine reaches the target temperature the controller locks on, constantly changing the pump speed with traffic and throttle conditions, maintaining the target temperature independent of the engine speed.

The important improvement for your vehicle comes from the fact that most of the power the mechanical pump takes from the engine can be reclaimed with the use of an EWP hence the fuel savings. By removing the parasitic power losses of belt-driven water pumps, the EWP may provide up to 10kw of extra power and additional fuel savings. The engine power used by the mechanical pump increases as the cube of its speed – so when the mechanical pump speed doubles from idle speed say; 600rpm to 1200 rpm, the power it takes increases by eight times. Then another eight times going to 2400 rpm, and so on up to maximum engine speed. It is this extra power and torque that is released by deleting the mechanical pump that provides the fuel savings that is estimated to be 3.5% to 10%.

Major European Manufacturers have implemented EWP’s as standard issue on a number of their vehicles, we have documents show that and EWP uses 90% less energy than conventional systems, i.e.: the mechanical water pump. Other advantages will include lower emissions by virtue of faster engine warm up, better engine temperature management, eliminating engine heat soak and improved engine life.

Weight reduction is a key requirement of any automotive manufacturer seeking fuel savings and our EWP will weight around 900 grams up to 1,151 grams (dependent on EWP Type) compared to a typical mechanical pump at 3 to 4 kg. Not only is our EWP considerably lighter when matched against the mechanical pump but we would also be replacing several outdated components with one environmentally friendly product which once again helps improve performance and fuel consumption.

Davies, Craig’s range of patented Electric Water Pumps include the EBP (12v), EWP®80 (12v) and the EWP®115 (12v & 24v) in both Nylon66 and Alloy housings. The new EWP®115 (115 litres per minute) in Alloy and Nylon66 is designed to replace a vehicle’s existing mechanical belt-driven water pump and is the latest in Davies Craig’s range of simple, DIY electric water pumps which are all univesal fit. Its lightweight, compact, more powerful design is suitable for all types of vehicles including small, to large plus high-performance and 4WD vehicles. It’s a vital performance product that improves engine cooling management whilst giving more power, torque and increased fuel economy. All deliver 3% to 5% improved fuel economy, increased power while lowering environmental impact by reducing emissions.



The EWP® is available in 2 sizes:
EWP80 (12 volt only) - for engines up to 3 litres "naturally aspirated" (INSTRUCTION SHEET)
EWP115 (12 & 24 volt only) - for V8 engines, heavy duty 4WDs or over 400HP (INSTRUCTION SHEET)
The EWP® can be used to replace the existing mechanical water pump or as a ‘booster’ to your existing mechanical pump. EWP® fit most makes and models of vehicles on the road today and by removing the parasitic power losses of belt-driven water pumps, the EWP® may provide up to 10kW of extra power.

The many benefits of the EWP include:
Increased Power and Torque
Increased cooling capability
Eliminating Heat Soak
Better control of engine temperature
Flexible options for pump control
Options for pump control
1. Used in conjunction with Digital EWP® Controller
The Digital Controller has a micro-processer which will run the EWP® at exactly the right flow rate maintaining the engine temperature you ‘set’.

2. Use in conjunction with Thermal Switch
Combine the EWP® with an adjustable Thermal Switch to add a cooling boost to an overheating mechanical pump cooling system.

3. Continuous Running
Wire the pump to the ignition for maximum cooling - suitable for race vehicles, very hot climates and chronically overheating engines.

EWP Kits come with everything you need for DIY installation including easy to understand instructions.
Digital Controller and Thermal switches are sold separately.

Wow! Thank you! Great info! You should post this in the tech advice section! Well, I've already got the water pump, but thats a great alternate should anything go wrong.

Click here for the Website

Thanks!

Pete

Progress from today was minimal. Just mounted the new electric fan on the radiator, then customized the housing so the fan will fit. See attached. Schedule is starting to clear up, so stay tuned! Things should get pretty interesting.





Thanks!

Pete

Side motor mounts are in. Lots of painstaking bondo work as well. Things are finally moving again though!





Thanks!

Pete

More bodywork done. Doors are next!



Thanks!

Pete

Looking Good Pete. How are you doing on time?

Haha, not well! A lot of personal stuff going on right now. Anyhow, I was able to get down to the shop for a day full of spreading bondo and sanding it off. I've been thinking about the motor idling high the last few days, and was poking around the motor when I found that one of the studs for the heat riser on the bottom of the intake was missing. Vaccum leak!!! Plugged it up, and it is now idling at 900rpm. Good deal!

Motor Running

Pictures coming later tonight...

Thanks!

Pete

Just about everything is bondo-ed up! I started taping off all the holes for the first few coats of blocking primer! It's starting to get exciting! We also sandblasted and painted a bunch more parts. I'm just glad to be back in the shop. I almost shriveled up and died from withdrawl the last few days, so it's nice to be back.

I was having trouble with the video, so it was reposted, new link here: Revised: Motor Running.

One more thing. We started to get into the dash board today. Tore it all apart, fixed the clock and started looking at the speedometer. We have heard of speedometers that operate by sticking a magnetic transponder on the wheel or through GPS. The freese plug in the speedo outlet of the Saginaw transmission is going to be really tough to get out, so we wanted to weigh our options before going to far. Has anyone tried this or have any advice/ reccomendations pertaining to electronic aftermarket speedometer setups? Anything is appreciated.















Thanks!

Pete

The cars getting so nervous it might start changing colors here pretty quick! The first few coats of blocking primer are going on in the morning.



Thanks!

Pete

I was starting to get tired of flat black anyway. This is getting exciting!





Sawhorses where harmed in this production.



Thanks!

Pete

Really getting close now. Have you mentioned what the final body color will be? I coulda missed it. Also regarding your dash. If you don't know, there are very good paint kits available to recreate the "wood" look if you are going that way.

http://www.woodgraining.com

Thanks Drew! I was thinking about woodgraining as well. You did the work for me! I'll run it past gramps and see what he thinks. Thanks!

The final color should be a deep blue - no sparkles/metal flakes. Just straight dark blue. I believe the original color was called Export Blue. We'll look at some paint chip books to get the final color, but we want something similar to the original deep blue that my grandpa had on his car.

Thanks!

Pete

Lots of really nice cars are ruined by paint. That is one reason primered cars are so popular they haven't been screwed up yet.You are smart to keep it simple. GM had several nice blues and greens back then.

I hope the saw horse preservation league doesn't see your last picture.

Not much for today. Again. Sorry, more personal stuff. Will be back at it tomorrow. Hope to have it in to paint by mid week!

Thanks!

Pete

I spent most of the day sanding the body. I've got most of the bumps worked out with 150 grit sandpaper. We're going to go down to 600 grit, so there's plenty left to do, although it should get easier as the sandpaper gets finer. Boy it's tedious stuff! Not sure if I've already said this, but my hat goes off to you full time body workers. It's brutal. Anyhow, I'm going to spend the next few days up in Indiana doing college stuff, so it should get pretty dull on this thread at least until about mid-week. Hopefully grandpa might get a bug in his butt and go sanding some more, but I don't want him to work too hard.

Also, we looked around at some local hardware stores and found a good color for the dash. It's pretty close to original, so that's good. We'll put it all together, then decide if we want to go the extra mile with the wood graining. I think it looks okay.





Thanks!

Pete

Is that there 1940 high-powered Chevrolet coming to Indiana . . . on its own power? That i'd love to see!

God's Peace to you.

d
Inliner #1450

Haha! I want to. I still have to convince dad that it's "safe." Will probably have to put a big roll cage and 4 point seat belts in it but if that's what it takes, so be it.

Thanks!

Pete

Whew! Finally back to work! Body is sanded down to 500 grit paper and at the painters! The final color we chose was a dark blue found on a 1974 Mac Commercial Truck. Should be painted by Monday. I hope it turns out good. We also pulled the tires off the rims and will be sandblasting them tomorrow. Rims will be painted the same color as the body. Firewall and inner fenders will be a glossy black.



Thanks!

Pete

It will be a thing of beauty. You guys have done a ton of work. I hope it all goes back together with no hitches. Well a few small ones are to be expected.

Haha, yeah! It hit me like a ton of bricks the other day. Once this thing is painted and upholstered, things are going to start flying back together. There should not be too many hitches because we didn't make any customizations to anything on the body. Fingers are crossed. Also, the pile of parts in the other barn is starting to thin out, which is a welcomed sight. The last real worry I have is getting the body home and on the frame without ripping up our new paint. Knock on wood!

Progress from today: Rims and dashboard are sandblasted. The dashboard components (glove box lid, instrument panel etc.) are painted. I think they turned out well. Also, gramps spent the day polishing chrome and putting in the new glass. It really looks great!





Thanks!

Pete

Hey, bombing the dash parts in that color came out great!
Who needs wood graining anyway?

Haha, we might! I still really like the woodgraining idea. Like I said, we're going to see how things turn out and go from there. I'm not going to trash the idea yet! We would have done it from the get go, it's just we thought we might try the $20 dollar option before going with an expensive woodgrain. I hope it fits well. Thanks!

Progress from today was minimal once again. Gramps took a personal day, so naturally things were going to be slow. Rims are primed. I ran out of primer, so the dash didn't get primed. With all the body parts at the painters, the shop was fairly empty, so that gave me the chance to do the first real clean up for a while. We can walk around in there now which is nice. Anyhow, more to come tomorrow.

Side note: Does anyone have any ideas about 1940 steering boxes. Nobody is remanufacturing 1940 Steering boxes, nobody wants to rebuild them and I can't find any NOS boxes. I might start hitting up the junk yards, but before I do that I thought I'd make a shout out to you guys. Anyone have any ideas of interchangeable boxes or ways to rebuild them etc.? Thank you!



Thanks!

Pete

Rims are scuffed up and ready for paint. The steering box is back together and surprisingly tight. (whew!) Also, Grandpa got back to polishing the trim. Unfortunately, while he was doing that a piece caught an edge in the buffer, jerked up and ripped open his hand pretty bad. I pulled him inside, wrapped him up, set him in his chair in front of the coverage of the races at our local Sonoma Raceway and he was napping before I got out of the door. Kinda funny about the napping part but jeez, I really hate to see him hurt himself like that. He cant just jump back up like he used to. Luckily, he was back out later that day to help with the steering box, but boy that shook me up seeing him like that. Getting old ain't fun.



Thanks!

Pete