Inliners International Forums General Discussion Engines 250 head with EGR?

I was talking to the machinest yesterday about doing my cylinder head (intergrated). Told him I was using this head because of smog reasons.He said that the only reason I need to use that head was because of the EGR.
He said that his buddy has a non-intergrated head for sell that has the EGR built into the head. He said that I should be able to use this head and still pass the smog test.This way I can run what ever intake and exhaust that I wanted.

Is this true, is there such a head out there?

thanks vince

Dear Vince;

I don't know about that head, but 1974 and older in California, don't require a 'smog check' any more.

Seems to me that an EGR would be in the intake manifold with a bleed valve down into the exhaust manifold under it. The non intergrated heads, if they ran an EGR, would have the EGR in the intake manifold and not on the head. Prior to the intergrated head the smog heads only had A.I.R. ports threaded into the top of the exhaust ports and no other add ons.

I'm sure the man knows what he is talking about but he may be thinking of the non intergrated head with the A.I.R. ports. They have no provision for an EGR.

John, I know but mines an '81 so I'm kind of stuck with the intergrated head,guess I could put one of those bent things in it.Just kidding.

Mike, ya this has me baffled as I don't know how the EGR would work if it was in the head?

I told him to have the guy bring to the shop so I could check it out.He said he wants $200.00 for the head.I want to lay my head gasket on it and see if its the same and get the #s off it.

Thanks vince

If you want to, I would thing you can install an older non integral head in your van & still pass smog.
You would need a down pipe fabbed, any muffler shop can do that.
You might want to look into this a little to see if you can/want go that route.?????

If I remember correctly, my Mom's 73 Nova had an EGR valve & the head was non integral w/air injection ports.
The EGR valve was located on the exhaust manifold.

I'm trying to do my homework to see what way to go and still pass smog.

So if its like the 73 nova,I would have to run the stock exhaust to keep the EGR?

thanks vince

The trouble with passing the smog test in California is that you have to pass a visual inspection that shows the correct part numbers for the year of the car. If it doen't pass the visual, they won't even sniff the exhaust.

Thats what I'm worried about.If they open the hood and its suppose to have intergrated head and its not that could be a problem.
Then again do they really know what their looking at? If everthing is there and working and it looks stock, is this a chance worth taking?

I never understood Cal's smog test. I mean as long as it passes the sniffer whats the difference whats under the hood? Now that they do the dyno test it really doesn't make since.

vince

Most people (smog guys) do not know what they are looking at esp an old inline Chevy.
I took my Syclone in for a smog check & they told me the turbo was not stock.
As long as you have the required EGR, PVC valve, breather from valve cover to air cleaner ,etc all hooked up, you should have no problem.

Dear Vince;

Yea, your stuck all right.

The BAR spends 85% of It's time/money checking "Smog Stations" for 'this & that' etc.

Here in California; It's the largest & most well orchestrated consumer fruad ever devised. Since the new rules, there's no stopping it.

You have to get a pre 1975 vehicle is all, or move out of state.

FUBAR...

Well guess what I just got in the mail?

Registration renewal, smog test required at a test only station.

So I guess I'll see what it is they look at.

Don't want a pre '75 van ,so guess I'm stuck till I can afford to move out of state.

Your right there is no stopping it and I imagine it will only get worse.

Need to win the lotto,lol

vince

They say the "test only(state) smogs" are selected randomly, but it sure seems like they are always going after the 70's and 80's cars. It's like there is some king of old car profiling going on if you ask me.

They aint so random, thats what I had to do 2 years ago now that I think about it.
My dads 92 or 93 bronco had to do the test only the last time he smogged it.

This week I got to get the van ready for the West Coast Van Nationals next weekend,so I'll have to deal with the smog the next week.

Dear Vince;

They check everything.

1. Make an appointment for your test.

2. Make sure It's tuned properly to factory specs, all vacuum lines attached with a 'proper' gas cap.

3. Make sure It's warmed up fully before the test. A short drive @ 55 is good.

4. Show up 5 min before & don't shut it off.

Most will pass if in good shape.

Good luck.

Thanks for the tips John.It ought to be interesting with this cam going flat.

About the gas cap I want to change to a locking gas cap.Went down to the store and there is 2 available vented and pre-vented.Not sure but I guess I probably need the pre-vented for smog reasons.What do you think?

I think the vent is 'one way' (incomming) and the cap has a ratchet mechanism.

There test is to turn it to see if it clicks.

Sometimes they actually pull the cap & test the vent.

I/we had to take a cap off another car to pass my 74 when it still needed that nonsense.

Yeah the cap testing hose is hooked to the smog machine and they will test it in real time to Sacremento. Alot of non test only stations just leave a good cap on all the time and don't bother with your cap. But state will fail you for even the smallest of dry rott cracks on the gasket.

Now I'm Thinking maybe I should try and smog it before I take it on a 250 mile trip just in case something happens to it.

You need to 'shop' for a good "smog station" and their out there.

They make their money by doing a GOOD JOB for the customer, like any other business and can't waste time fooling around with a vehicle that won't pass.

A GOOD one will look over your vehicle before It's connected to the State. If It's going to fail (by visual) they get you out of the line (at no charge) so you can get if fixed etc.

It's the best PR and advertising they have.

As I've stated, It's a huge fraud here and their (good ones) just trying to "live within the system" and make an honest buck.

This is why the "test only" station is the lesser of many evils.

Good luck.

Its suppose to rain tommorrow so I'm thinking about taking it down.

There is nothing wrong with the gas cap,just want to change it to a locking cap.

Well took it down for smog test yesterday and it passed with no problem.I'm really suprised at how clean it ran.
I tried talked to the guy a little bit but he didn't speak much english,lol.
On the gas cap, I need a pre-vented one.The tank is vented through the charcoal canister.
He also said that as long as I own this vehicle, it will always have to do the test only. The state has a list of vehicle models that are know to be high polluters and they will always have to do the test only.

vince

Outstanding, glad to hear it.

If your on the "high poluter" list; you might want to keep it all stock so, you can keep driving it and pasing their test.

If you find something else to make a Hot Rod out of (one that's pre 1975) it can be 're-designed' however YOU like.

Happy trails.

Yeah if you have to go to a state smog test sometimes it's worth going to a regular smog station and getting a pre-test, just so you are sure you will pass the real thing. The state smog test is "live" to the DMV, so if you fail it bad, (gross polluter)then you always have go to test only. Also, if Im not mistaken, you have to go every year instaed of every other year. Does anyone know if there any plans for the 1975's to be smog exempt someday? It sure took a long time out here in CA for 1974's to be exempt.

D;

The 'old rule' was 30 years of age, then exempt.
The 'new rule' now is; 1975 and newer, forever.

There's another; If your vehicle has failed badly in the past and been moved into a diferent class. I'm not sure on that (gross poluter) but maybe. Once there, you never can be put back (get out) no matter what your emmisions are. I've heard your only allowed so many years on that too. Then you must dismantle/store your vehicle or sell it out of state.

They used to test to make sure you were okay, but the State has 'outlawed that too'. They just won't let go of their 'sacred cow'.

The desert was always exempt, but now were 'locked into' it as well. The rules here are a little less strict though and a 'good station' will look every vehicle over before connecting it to "big brother's smog lie"........

I was just lucky to escape with my 74 Impala. It weighs 6,000# and would barely move with all that (expletive deleted) on it.

It's all 'nuts'.

PS: I've been on several radio 'talk shows' and beat them down (bureaucrats) every time. I've also written several articles on the subject but no takers on that. Everyone here in Calif. is scared of the government & perhaps rightfully so.

There's a 4 billion dollar oil tax on next elections ballod,

We should take this further in "bench racing".

I have a vehicle that failed as a gross poluter.1991 GMC
Had fixed that by giving it a tune up passed easy then.
So now every two years I need to take it to a test only facility? Then after a few years I need to dismantle the car?

"The 'new rule' now is; 1975 and newer, forever."

Here's what the DMV says about polution control years: http://www.dmv.org/ca-california/smog-check.php

Dear Hank;

The law has certain exemptions and you need to verify the requirements in your specific case.
Most likely you are okay as your vehicle is passing.

In some cases they (gross polluters)won't/can't/don't pass (at first)and must go to the State's referee. Those are the ones I was refering to.

Please check with the BAR to be sure in your situation.

Good luck.

Thanks guys,as far as I know this van has never failed the smog test.My uncle bought this new in 1981.However this motor/vehicle combo is known to be a high polluter there for I'm stuck doing the smog only test.

I don't really like the dash in the pre '75s, but I'm going to take some measurements and see if I can't put the later dash in.

vince