Inliners International Forums General Discussion Engines 292 water pump issues

I got me here a 292 I am trying to figure out the water pump on. This is supposed to be going in a 72 Jimmy so I am using all the era correct accessory brackets. The water pump is just sticking out way too much, it is a 73-75 pump I believe, the parts store didnt have a 72ish one. Does a shorter water pump exsist? The water pump pulley doesn't line up at all with everything else.

Looks like an incorrect power steering pump pulley.
It is supposed to go further forward,IIRC?

MBHD

Looking at your pictures the crank pulley is back where it belongs and the water pump will work with it but your P.S. and A.C. are both back inline with the cam gear. Are they mounted correctly? Also the A.C. belt would have to run through the lower radiator hose the way it is mounted now. I don't think the water pump is the problem.
Good luck

Hmm, the weird thing is that the AC and PS line up with a groove on the crank pulley. Am I not sure of the PS pump and pulley but the AC can't be mounted any other way. I have a few different WP pulleys and every one of them is no where near lining up with the crank. Unless the crank pulley is wrong????

The engine that came out of the Jimmy was a 250 with the ALT as the only accessory so I am adding all of these items blindly I guess.

I have a double grove P.S. pulley, & it sits more forward than yours,it sits so much forward, you cannot see the pulley retaining nut from a direct side view, the pulleys cover up the retaining nut.

Also, looks like your AC pump is mounted incorrecly?

Could you post a couple more pics of the AC pump?

MBHD

Double PS pulley? Never have come across that yet, I have a double alt pulley but it is the wrong one.

Here is a illustration of how it goes together, I don't have an actual picture on hand but there isn't really a different way it could be mounted.

The double pulley only uses the front groove.

On your illustration, the AC compressor sits in front of the "c" bracket,not behind it.????

I think you can play around with the AC compressor & move it fwd.

MBHD

You might check out this auction on ebay. It looks like this set-up pushes the pump forward on the motor than your current brackets.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/chevy-6-p...093919203QQrdZ1

The GM manual picture above shows a small dampner with a removable pulley. The one you have may be for a later model, if so the rear groove ran the smog pump which mounted down low and behind everything.

Hank, you were right about the AC, when I first slapped it on quick it looked like there was no way for the black bracket to go behind but I fiddled with it. It looks like it will line up know. I was worried for a second thinking maybe they never put AC on 292's :p

After looking at that auction I remembered that I had a set of PS brackets laying around from a 70 250 Nova so I tried those on since the head on this 292 is a 250 head

No go, the brackets hit the water pump and the alt adjustment thing on the bottom won't work and looks stupid due to the extra height of the 292. BUT it does move the pump foward like suggested they might.

Next problem is the alt sitting way back, I probably have it on a 250 bracket and I would need a 292 bracket if it exsists, can anyone confirm this?

So I am down to figuring out these PS brackets.

Here is a comparison of a 292 bracket and a 250 bracket, the one with the tag is the 250. They are both basically the same so unless there is a different bottom that bolts on to these I have to find another bracket that will bring the pump foward.

I would assume the picture is of a 250 and they would need the extra pulley bolted on to run the AC. Worst part about this is that alot of the parts I have I don't know what they came off of so what you are suggesting might be the case.

GM, There are several Alt brackets. The is a cast and the one you have. I have an extra cast Alt bracket, little rusty well maybe more than a little, but useable from a 292. It's yours for the ride. Send me a PM.

Larry

As Walt said you can move alt bracket forward by drilling new holes if you need to you can weld a new strap on the old bracket to make it work. I run a serpintine belt so had to make all brackets. It is easy just look at stock bracket and decide how to modify or make new that will work.To quote John M "thats how we did it back in the 50s"
Good luck and if you make your own it will be something to be proud of.

Thanks for all the input guys, part of the fun of this for me is figuring out all these parts and weird combinations to make things work. Its like a treasure hunt, plus I am trying to make this truck look dead stock right down to the plain jane hubcaps so I am trying to keep things factory and even in the correct era.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by big bill:
I run a serpintine belt so had to make all brackets.

Big Bill, do you have any pics of your belt installation?
Or could you tell us what pulleys you used?
Water pump, crank, power steering? Alt?
Thanks
MBHD

It looks to me like the alt bracket is upside down. If you flip it it will move the alt out. It looks like the adjuster groove is "smiling" is this the case? Hard to tell looking down at it.

My power steering pump bracket looks completely different than that. I will get a picture when I get home and post it.

edit: I looked at the earlier pictures and the bracket is upside down. Flip that around so the groove is "frowning". And then move the alt to the outside of the bottom bracket.

The alt fits into the lower alt bracket that holds the alt to the engine, the bracket sandwiches the alt so you can't move it to the outside. I installed the alt tensioning brackets according to some schematics I have, they show the bracket as a smile which I also thought looked wrong, but it does work. I think I have some different lower alt brackets so I will check to see if any of those are longer.

It just doesn't seem like it can adjust properly with it like that. The adjusting arm just looks like it would fit in the groove of the water pump if it was flipped. Can the bottom bracket adjust to get narrower? I am using a different one on my 292 so I don't know how the stock one works.

The tensioning bracket isn't really a problem yet, I tried flipping it to what looks correct and it doesn't work. The issue I am having with the alt is the bracket that bolts to the block to hold the alt on.

Hank I don't have pictures so I will try to discribe every thing. I run two Serpintine belts. I run a SBC 8" damper w/ a late model crank pulley, a late 90s GM PS pump stock pulley, GM alternator w/stock pulley, and a sanden 508 compressor with matching pulley. In order to turn the stock water pump the proper direction I used a dble pulley off of a 1988 four cyl mustang. My crank pulley runs the ps, alt, & water pump then I run my AC off of the second or rear pulley on the water pump. My ps mounts low on right side, ac high right, alternator low left. I come off the crank around an idler then around PS and back around a second idler then over water pump to alt and back to crank. The water pump pulley had to be spaced out to match crank pulley. I wondered if this would increase wear on water pump bearings but so far no problem (going on 2
years). This makes a very nice setup that tends to blow peoples mind because "they didn't know GM made an inline with a serpintine belt system." I hope this helps if you have any questions after reading this ask and I will try to answer. Used smooth idlers on back side of belt.

big bill, Thanks!

So it sounds like you installed a crank pulley for the later style long water pump SBC, which spaced everything really far forward?

I was planning on using the short style SBC serpentine crank pulley, so I would not have to space all the accessories so far forward. Should work huh.

MBHD

Hank I used the flat crank pulley that almost touches the Damper. I actually used a Trans Am pulley and had to redrill it to a three bolt pattern from a four. I had it laying around, chev uses the same offset pulley that is a direct bolt up. If you are running a small dia damper you might be able to mount it backwards over top of the damper but I never tried that because I like the larger damper, it smoothes out the cam a little and makes things last longer I believe.

big bill
That set up sounds nice. Can you give more details, were all pullies came from, what belts, etc.
Can you take pics and e-mail them ??????????

thanks

Elm 2627 Go up about three post and most of your questions will be answered. If not let me know. I can't get any pictures unless I remove radiator. So if I ever get any pictures that will show details I will post them.

Big Bill, Sorry about that. What pulley did you use on the water pump and what about the belts.
thanks
Ed

I checked the lower alt mount and there is no way to redrill it to move it foward, the bracket is too short for that. Anyone have a picture of a mount for a 292?

GM You can weld a piece of 1/4 x 1 stock to the existing mount running full length of the block mating surface as long as you need then one hole will go through the bracket and the new plate and the other hole will be in the new plate only . then select the proper length bolts and lock washers to fasten it to block. If you don't have a welder go to front hole in bracket that you don't need and drill through new extension plate then drill a taper in the new plate to recess a flat head bolt and install a 5/16 flat head bolt through new plate and bracket then bolt on as above.

The pic you posted earlier with two brackets I believe are just two of the same brackets, not a 292 and a 250 bracket, but this photo of yours may be a help to you.



Your new lower bracket I believe is the right one. You said this new bracket gets in the way of the old alt bracket, that's because the old bracket is not needed. Look on the bottom of the new bracket in the pic and you will see a curved slot where the top of the alt bolts into it. Removing the old alt bracket should let the new bracket sit down into place where the top three bolts line up.

Hope this helps!

The top PS bracket is for a 250 my engine is a 292 which is taller so the alt won't fit into that adjusting groove on the bottom of the PS bracket. There is a couple inches difference.

I believe you have installed a 250 waterpump. The 292 pump has an extra outlet for the bypass hose. I just finished installing power steering on my 292 in a 70 C-10 and it was a real education.

That pump has 3 outlets on it, doesn't the 250 pump only have 2?