Inliners International Forums General Discussion Bench racing Smog laws

I have heard that the Dyno's the smog stations use can simulate unrealistic road conditions, and they often cause auto transmissions to fail. Years ago I lost a TH350 in a Nova the day after a smog test, and I also know a guy who lost the trans in a Aerostar(don't laugh!) during the test. Anyone else hear of this happening ?

Dear Dan;

I would think it would be in the "hands of the operator". I have no 'real world' experience with dynos.

I know in the early 80s I took several vehicles we had passed at our shop to a State contracted SMOG testing Corp. and they all were failed on the Dyno.

When I returned they still met/passed the required specs./limits (non Dyno.).

This forced us to re-test them at further expence in time to us and money to the customer. In fact; we had to lie on the paperwork to pass when the cars were "clean" under the existing laws.

I filled several complaints with the BAR that year on the testing station, with zero results because the shops owner wouldn't go to the court hearings etc.

I doubt a dyno test could damage a transmission but someone else might know better on that.

About the only way that i know of that, THAT could happen is if they Had to much load set on the rollers. Which would be like trying to do a power brake on Black top which in turn would over load/heat a AT tranny. Also the tranny could have already Been Weak and ready to go at anytime??

That makes perfect sense.

It would also cause more throttle pressure to maintain the speed required for the test, creating a higher HC reading, causing a "clean car" to fail.

Thanks Larry!!

Greetings . . .

My problem with Dyno testing is the qualifications and skill of the operators. I have '92 Toyota MR2 that is a rear engine rear-wheel drive vehicle.

When it came time to SMOG test, I took it to the station and stood by quietly and watched them set up the front wheels on the Dyno.

Then I walked out and told the guy to stop and I asked to see the manager. I asked the Mangler are you qualifed to run this place? He looked at me puzzled. I asked him if the operator was qualifed to perform the test? The Mangler said yes.

I then asked: Then why do you screw-ups have the front wheels of a rear wheel drive car up on a Dyno drum?

What if the owner was a chick or some Mr. Milk Toast who doesn't know (or care about) the difference between rear wheel, front wheel or four wheel drive? You guys are supposed to be pros . . .

He was miffed, but he brought another operator over to do the test . . .

regards,
Keith

I have had my 64 on a chassi dyno. And The way this test is done Is once the Motor Hits Its Peak
HP the test is Over. As to Your Smog testing I realy have no clue as to what they would do Or How.

Hi Twisted6 . . .

Dyno testing is designed to simulate road conditions. Under the 90's standards most cars could achieve what is called a 'Fast Pass' based soley on a sample of exhaust at idle. Only if the car fails the idle test is it put it on the Dyno.

Once on the Dyno the operator takes the car through a series of threshold tests - hold 25mph - hold 35mph - hold 45mph etc. This gives the catalytic converter a chance to heat up and do its job. This allows a car that is a polluter at idle to pass because it is OK under load.

In the case of my MR2 - it puts out to much HC at idle to Fast Pass. So I end up on the Dyno. The catalytic works fine at reducing HC emissions under load. Trouble is that the engine's combustion chamber design causes it to accumulate carbon which raises compression ratio. The result is NO emissions (nitrous oxides) which are a no-no from the EPAs perspective. And the catlytic cannot fix NO emissions. So my readings go up-and-up every two tests and then I need to have the carbon cleaned out before I can pass. GM sells a dissolver that one can pour in through the spark plug holes. The car is still serviced by dealer (where I bought it new ). They clean out the carbon with this solvent and I pass.

I just barely passed in '00; failed in '02; passed in '04 and just passed in '06. I expect I'll have to get the carbon cleaned out before my next scheduled test in '08.

regards,
Keith

Aw Ok hum hehehe They surly wouldn't like my compression then would they LOL. something I have done along with others that have used a little water down the intake system to help clean off carbon build up Others i know have also used ATF tranny fluid. Not sure how well the tranny fluid works. But it surly smokes up a storm LOL for a few minutes. I know water works pretty good.

Larry's correct, water works great.

Simply spray some down the Carb. while holding the throttel open while keeping the speed up around 2,500.

Having the engine fully 'warmed up' is another way of getting it to pass, also.

Good luck.

There might be something to the tranny issue.Of coarse the tranny must have been on its last leg anyways. Looking at the smog papers I just got.They performed a 15mph and a 25mph, I remember hearing my van reving but was talking to the other guy so didn't really pay any attention.Anyways heres the what I just noticed,

15mph at 1433rpm
25mph at 1397rpm

And they hold it there for a while.
I'd have to crunch some numbers but I'm thinking that the 15mph test was done in first gear?

vince

One problem with the dyno test is when they forget to put a fan in front of the car before the test.You sit in line for forty minutes,ten minutes to check the vin,plates,converter,fuel hole size and gas cap test.By the time you do all of this the car is red hot then they put it on the dyno and do stop and start testing.If you do this on a 90 degree day you better hope all is well under the hood.In IL you only get three chances to pass then they suspend your plates.They have a law that they want to try to pass that if the car fails you can never get plates again.

It's all FUBAR!!

If your vehicle passes; It shouldn't matter what's under the hood or how you have it 'set up' as the vehicle belongs to you.

Its just a "power trip" & does nothing for the environment; Only the government agency.

John,
although I wouldn't necessarily call it a 'power trip', I agree with everything else you say.

Here in OR we have the DEQ- Dept. of Environmental Quality. Only in the Portland metro area and other larger metro areas in the state does one have to have vehicle smog checks. If you live outside the relatively small boundary, you never have to have your vehicle checked regardless of what year it is. Last I checked, vehicles can still emit lot's of pollution whether or not they're in the confines of the metro area!?! I find it extrememly frustrating that one can live just outside the boundary and yet drive in the city without ever having to do a check regardless of what year one's vehicle is! In fact, I've known people that have their cars registered outside of the boundary so that they don't have to go through the DEQ test.

Look, I can appreciate the fact that more cars in a metro area increases pollution in that area and creates higher health issues for people in that given area. However, I think it's a double standard since pollution is pollution regardless of where one lives and I'm concerned about the entire planet not just one tiny metro area. Personally, I try to keep my cars at their best running condition, and I make sure that all my cars pass even though I don't have to.

On a slightly different note, I don't get the fact that in some areas of the country one can take an older vehicle with an older engine that puts out more emissions and swap in a newer high performance crate engine with EFI and whatnot and have to comply with the newer model engine standards rather than the year of the vehicle. You're improving the quality of the air by putting in a better performing engine that puts out less emissions! I don't get it.

I'm not sure how they can pass a law like that.I've seen cars that were not even 4 years old not pass.Out here all new cars are "now" exempt for the first 6 years.How many do you think will pass on the first test?
Their going to take their plates and make them go buy another new car? Sounds scary!

"NO SMOG FOR YOU" The Smog Nazi

Brad,thats just how it starts,in a few years it will be the whole state.

Gentlemen;

The people that MFG the test equipment 'lobby' the Legislature & this is how. There following the bone like the California politians did.

This is why I call it a "power trip". The more money the government can take from the public, the more 'power' it has.

We are 'deep trouble' (US citizens) here and probably on the verge of a total government 'shutdown'; as the sloth, incompetence and concern over "political correctness" has made it almost unworkable.

We won "big time" last election here in California, but that's not the trend.

Ever try to get a buliding permit?? It's easyer to get on welfare.