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#44193 - 10/08/08 04:18 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Mean buzzen half dozen A.K.A. Hank]
efi-diy efi-diy Active BB Member Registered: 11/21/04 Posts: 1392 Loc: Calgary Alberta Canada	Originally Posted By: Mean buzzen half dozen A.K.A. Hank EFI-DIY From there to the tail pipe its a 4" system orginally off of a duramax. Got 25' of pipe, hangers, muffler all kinds of bends . It sounds like you are using a stock Duramax muffler? If so, that will cause some back pressure & cause your turbo to spool up slow. Two cents thrown. MBHD I think its an aftermarket exhaust - the muffler is a straight thru glass pack. . _________________________ 51 GMC 4.2 turbo Can't solved today's problems using the same technology/thinking that created them
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#44197 - 10/08/08 07:10 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Titen]
Beater of the Pack Beater of the Pack Active BB Member Registered: 10/06/07 Posts: 2518 Loc: Northern Nevada	..... some of us are staying with the original intent (don't worry Tom I am never going to say 'old school' again), but ..... [/quote] Tim,Old school, old school, old school we can say it all we want. Our concept of that is as broad as our ideas of which inline we want to build. That is what makes this site so interesting. We are a very diverse group that has little in common other than easy spark plug changes and a propensity to be a bit different. I am grateful to the founders of Inliners and those who make this site possible. Now as far as "original intent"......... $\:D$ _________________________ "I wonder if God created man because he was disappointed in the monkey?" Mark Twain
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#44212 - 10/09/08 06:45 AM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Beater of the Pack]
inline300 inline300 Active BB Member Registered: 12/13/04 Posts: 460	Reason for no aftermarket, is this engine was only stuck in a big ass SUV, people in general wont make the transition from, take the kiddies to soccer practice and get groceries to, hmm...I wonder just how fast I could get the kiddies to the field and to the store and back with the old six banger...:D Now if GM woulda pushed their twin turbo SUV prototype in everyones faces, as they sat in the dealer showroom waiting for the salesman to come back from speaking with the "manager" as to whether they could give them the "deal" of the day and shown them how 400+hp was tangible...then things would be different and much more inliner friendly. $\:\)$ Sad part is, the gen III v8 in a ligher/aerodynamic vehicle, this is the higher hp LS1/LS2 versions, actually gets really nice mpg, 30 isnt out of the realm of possibility. Edited by inline300 (10/09/08 06:55 AM)
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#44234 - 10/09/08 09:18 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: inline300]
Beater of the Pack Beater of the Pack Active BB Member Registered: 10/06/07 Posts: 2518 Loc: Northern Nevada	I don't know about that. Look where GM stuck the 270 & 302 and our forerodders found them and scared the stuffin' out of a generation of V-guys. The shame is that many of us seem to be late picking up on the potential of the 4200s. I agree with Marc and wonder why we bury our heads in the casting sand of an out dated design. Tradition? Old Sc....... _________________________ "I wonder if God created man because he was disappointed in the monkey?" Mark Twain
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#44240 - 10/10/08 04:36 AM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Beater of the Pack]
inline300 inline300 Active BB Member Registered: 12/13/04 Posts: 460	You have a point but now people have many more options. I hope im wrong, it would be cool to see the 4200 catch on, then efi-diy will have the monopoly, just hope he remembers his buddies on inliners. $\:D$ Anyone have the engine weight for the 4200 vortec, vs say a 5300? I cant seem to find it. Edited by inline300 (10/10/08 04:44 AM)
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#44245 - 10/10/08 05:57 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: inline300]
Mean buzzen half dozen A.K.A. Hank Mean buzzen half dozen A.K.A. Hank Active BB Member Registered: 09/23/04 Posts: 4585 Loc: Ca	Just thought about the comment about the newer 06 & newer head flows 50% better on the exhaust, efi-diy,,you stated it will help w/the turbo spool up better. I disagree,ports being bigger ,less velosity,slower spool up. A few ways to bring the spool up is by Nitrous,smaller turbine housing (I recommend),or a loose converter,not being a BB turbo,3500 stall is aprox the min. stall needed,that's if you want to be able to boost launch. Two cents thrown. Goodluck! MBHD _________________________ 12 port SDS EFI
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#44252 - 10/10/08 09:53 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: inline300]
efi-diy efi-diy Active BB Member Registered: 11/21/04 Posts: 1392 Loc: Calgary Alberta Canada	Originally Posted By: inline300 You have a point but now people have many more options. I hope im wrong, it would be cool to see the 4200 catch on, then efi-diy will have the monopoly, just hope he remembers his buddies on inliners. $\:D$ Anyone have the engine weight for the 4200 vortec, vs say a 5300? I cant seem to find it. No worries here, even Ford owners are welcomed... $\:\/$ I'd be happy just seeing the engine catch on and helping folks with it. _________________________ 51 GMC 4.2 turbo Can't solved today's problems using the same technology/thinking that created them
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#44253 - 10/10/08 10:08 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Mean buzzen half dozen A.K.A. Hank]
efi-diy efi-diy Active BB Member Registered: 11/21/04 Posts: 1392 Loc: Calgary Alberta Canada	Originally Posted By: Mean buzzen half dozen A.K.A. Hank Just thought about the comment about the newer 06 & newer head flows 50% better on the exhaust, efi-diy,,you stated it will help w/the turbo spool up better. I disagree,ports being bigger ,less velosity,slower spool up. A few ways to bring the spool up is by Nitrous,smaller turbine housing (I recommend),or a loose converter,not being a BB turbo,3500 stall is aprox the min. stall needed,that's if you want to be able to boost launch. Two cents thrown. Goodluck! MBHD NO2 yep - agreed. Smaller turbine housing - good chance this will come to pass Higher stall - don't think I'll be able to get away without it - maybe a 100HP hit it'll shock the coverter enough..(maybe boom $\:\)$ ..) Last time out it was just a 20HP shot. AS for the ports for spooling yes and no - yes velocity is a good thing, but you also need volume... the small ports are so darn restrictive that I'm thinking the its choking the engine pretty good. We'll find out once the built engine goes in. Once a gas stream reached sonic velocity - its really hard for an orfice to pass more gas. The other item that you wouldn't know about is the internal passages in the turbo manifold are sized for the 90% of the later port. So on the early head the velocity falls off. So with the later head the gas stream will have to increase velocity as it enters the manifold. Worst case it'll be slow to spool but run like a raped ape once the boost comes up... Edited by efi-diy (10/10/08 10:09 PM) _________________________ 51 GMC 4.2 turbo Can't solved today's problems using the same technology/thinking that created them
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#44254 - 10/10/08 10:13 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: efi-diy]
efi-diy efi-diy Active BB Member Registered: 11/21/04 Posts: 1392 Loc: Calgary Alberta Canada	As far as aftermarket parts - I agree it sucks. The fabricator that finished welding my oil pan is will to build headers for the 4200 if he can get 15 committed orders. Mild steel or stainless. 6:1 straight tube or stepped pipe, or, 2 x 3:1 >> 2:1... With enough demand the parts will follow. Just got to relieve the engine of its orginal home.... _________________________ 51 GMC 4.2 turbo Can't solved today's problems using the same technology/thinking that created them
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#44255 - 10/11/08 12:20 AM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: efi-diy]
Nexxussian Nexxussian Active BB Member Registered: 06/12/07 Posts: 1342 Loc: Anchorage	We just had our first snow, and icy roads, give it a few months and I'm sure some will show up in the insurance salvage auctions. I'm thinkin a '53 Chev Bel Air 2D hardtop W/ a 4200 single turbo (mild, whatever won't blow up the 4L65E) and limited slip of some kind (in a non torque tube rear). Buffalo's lowering uprights and disc kit, poly bushings, ought to be a real sleeper :D. _________________________ My, what a steep learning curve. Erik II#5155
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#44259 - 10/11/08 06:02 AM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Nexxussian]
inline300 inline300 Active BB Member Registered: 12/13/04 Posts: 460	Any ideas on the weight of the 4200?
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#44263 - 10/11/08 11:45 AM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Nexxussian]
Beater of the Pack Beater of the Pack Active BB Member Registered: 10/06/07 Posts: 2518 Loc: Northern Nevada	Originally Posted By: Nexxussian We just had our first snow, and icy roads, give it a few months and I'm sure some will show up in the insurance salvage auctions. I'm thinkin a '53 Chev Bel Air 2D hardtop W/ a 4200 single turbo (mild, whatever won't blow up the 4L65E) and limited slip of some kind (in a non torque tube rear). Buffalo's lowering uprights and disc kit, poly bushings, ought to be a real sleeper :D. It snowed off and on all day yesterday and We woke up to 6" this morning. Oh well, there's a lot to do inside too! $\:o$ _________________________ "I wonder if God created man because he was disappointed in the monkey?" Mark Twain
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#44274 - 10/11/08 07:49 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Beater of the Pack]
Mean buzzen half dozen A.K.A. Hank Mean buzzen half dozen A.K.A. Hank Active BB Member Registered: 09/23/04 Posts: 4585 Loc: Ca	Here is a nice racing intake http://www.selfracing.com/engines/engine114.htm http://www.selfracing.com/engines/engine13.htm cams http://www.selfracing.com/engines/engine12.htm Headers http://www.selfracing.com/engines/engine15.htm MBHD _________________________ 12 port SDS EFI
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#44287 - 10/12/08 05:04 AM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Mean buzzen half dozen A.K.A. Hank]
inline300 inline300 Active BB Member Registered: 12/13/04 Posts: 460	400lbs sound right?
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#44294 - 10/12/08 02:10 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: inline300]
Beater of the Pack Beater of the Pack Active BB Member Registered: 10/06/07 Posts: 2518 Loc: Northern Nevada	Hank, Great pictures! Thanks _________________________ "I wonder if God created man because he was disappointed in the monkey?" Mark Twain
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#44297 - 10/12/08 03:49 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Beater of the Pack]
inline300 inline300 Active BB Member Registered: 12/13/04 Posts: 460	Your video says 155 KPA, isnt that 22psi?
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#44303 - 10/12/08 08:30 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: inline300]
efi-diy efi-diy Active BB Member Registered: 11/21/04 Posts: 1392 Loc: Calgary Alberta Canada	155Kpa absolute manifold pressure (101.7 is atmospheric pressure at sea level). _________________________ 51 GMC 4.2 turbo Can't solved today's problems using the same technology/thinking that created them
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#44315 - 10/13/08 04:37 AM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: efi-diy]
inline300 inline300 Active BB Member Registered: 12/13/04 Posts: 460	Oh yeah, this gets me everytime. Take 100 away for absolute manifold pressure, then 55kpa is about 8 psi. Gotchya
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#44322 - 10/13/08 10:59 AM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: inline300]
efi-diy efi-diy Active BB Member Registered: 11/21/04 Posts: 1392 Loc: Calgary Alberta Canada	Went to the public scale today I was kind of surprised at first... 3800#! << porky Then thinking about it.. added turbo, turbo manifold, intercooler, 4" exhaust system out to the back bumper, charge air plumbing, and NO2 bottle. If I remember correctly I think with the 292 the truck weighted 3550# but I never wrote that number down so its fuzzy. So at 3800# and 98.3 mph == 280RWHP >> 360ish at the crank. Density altitude was around 3800' so I think this HP # is about right. It line up with what the goofy chassis dyno reported. Before I installed the turbo the truck ran the same ET with the stock 4200 as it did with the tricked out 292 (ported lump port head big valves, cam, offy, holley 600, & headers). Edited by efi-diy (10/13/08 11:02 AM) _________________________ 51 GMC 4.2 turbo Can't solved today's problems using the same technology/thinking that created them
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#44347 - 10/14/08 04:23 AM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: efi-diy]
inline300 inline300 Active BB Member Registered: 12/13/04 Posts: 460	You need to drive this thing to work or something, get a co-worker to hold the cam while you show everyone just how wreckless a 51 can be. $\:D$ What are your expectations with the new engine? Earlier you mentioned supporting 750 with X injectors, you think it will get up in that area? This stuff is exciting and Im just a spectator, reading the play by play. $\:D$ Edited by inline300 (10/14/08 04:27 AM)
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#44400 - 10/16/08 09:48 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Beater of the Pack]
efi-diy efi-diy Active BB Member Registered: 11/21/04 Posts: 1392 Loc: Calgary Alberta Canada	Originally Posted By: Beater of the Pack ..... some of us are staying with the original intent (don't worry Tom I am never going to say 'old school' again), but ..... Tim,Old school, old school, old school we can say it all we want. Our concept of that is as broad as our ideas of which inline we want to build. That is what makes this site so interesting. We are a very diverse group that has little in common other than easy spark plug changes and a propensity to be a bit different. I am grateful to the founders of Inliners and those who make this site possible. Now as far as "original intent"......... $\:D$ [/quote] If you think about it ( maybe someone already said this) hotroding in it orginal intent was to put later model engines into older tin... think caddy V8's into model A's... etc.. _________________________ 51 GMC 4.2 turbo Can't solved today's problems using the same technology/thinking that created them
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#44427 - 10/19/08 06:50 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: efi-diy]
efi-diy efi-diy Active BB Member Registered: 11/21/04 Posts: 1392 Loc: Calgary Alberta Canada	Ok for all those inquiring minds... http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=uaPnBWZoqfQ Edited by efi-diy (10/19/08 07:27 PM) _________________________ 51 GMC 4.2 turbo Can't solved today's problems using the same technology/thinking that created them
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#44429 - 10/19/08 07:43 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: efi-diy]
tlowe #1716 tlowe #1716 12 PORT ADVERTISER Active BB Member Registered: 04/01/04 Posts: 2347 Loc: Dysart, Iowa	cool beans!!. that looks like a cocpit from an airplane with the guages and gismos. make it longer next time. tom _________________________ 12 PORT ADVERTISER http://www.inliners.org/Advertisers/index.html trbo writeup http://www.inliners.org/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=43253&fpart=1
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#44430 - 10/19/08 08:23 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: tlowe #1716]
efi-diy efi-diy Active BB Member Registered: 11/21/04 Posts: 1392 Loc: Calgary Alberta Canada	Funny now I'm used to 8 psi.. feels like nothing and want more... Not enough road around here unless we go way out in the boonies... _________________________ 51 GMC 4.2 turbo Can't solved today's problems using the same technology/thinking that created them
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#44431 - 10/19/08 08:43 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: efi-diy]
tlowe #1716 tlowe #1716 12 PORT ADVERTISER Active BB Member Registered: 04/01/04 Posts: 2347 Loc: Dysart, Iowa	you need to live in the boonies like me. drove mine 100 miles today oneway to pickup 2 292 short blocks and a mess of other goodies. it felt like the front end was going to come off the ground if i pushed the go petal to hard. 69 and sunny. 1 of the few autumn days we have left. so what is you timing settings? idle cruise boosted _________________________ 12 PORT ADVERTISER http://www.inliners.org/Advertisers/index.html trbo writeup http://www.inliners.org/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=43253&fpart=1
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#44432 - 10/19/08 10:47 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: tlowe #1716]
efi-diy efi-diy Active BB Member Registered: 11/21/04 Posts: 1392 Loc: Calgary Alberta Canada	Idle - 10* cruise - 25* low boost - 9->10* full boost - 6* 1-2 shift 50 mph 2-3 shift 80 mph 3-4 shift ????? not enough road anywhere near here Tom where do you shift your elky? Edited by efi-diy (10/19/08 10:51 PM) _________________________ 51 GMC 4.2 turbo Can't solved today's problems using the same technology/thinking that created them
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#44434 - 10/20/08 08:05 AM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: efi-diy]
inline300 inline300 Active BB Member Registered: 12/13/04 Posts: 460	Quote: Funny now I'm used to 8 psi.. feels like nothing and want more... Its a disease. $\:D$ Liked the video!!
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#44436 - 10/20/08 08:17 AM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: inline300]
Beater of the Pack Beater of the Pack Active BB Member Registered: 10/06/07 Posts: 2518 Loc: Northern Nevada	You'll get more with your new engine. You may get all you deserve! _________________________ "I wonder if God created man because he was disappointed in the monkey?" Mark Twain
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#44437 - 10/20/08 08:26 AM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Beater of the Pack]
tlowe #1716 tlowe #1716 12 PORT ADVERTISER Active BB Member Registered: 04/01/04 Posts: 2347 Loc: Dysart, Iowa	my shifts are done @ 4800 rpm. 1-2 is 35 mph 2-3 is 66 mph 3-4 is 108 mph (hope to see that at the track) _________________________ 12 PORT ADVERTISER http://www.inliners.org/Advertisers/index.html trbo writeup http://www.inliners.org/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=43253&fpart=1
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#44447 - 10/21/08 05:44 AM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: tlowe #1716]
seiscanecos74 seiscanecos74 Active BB Member Registered: 11/11/04 Posts: 176	Isn't 4800rpms a bit low? Do you have enough timing to fill up the turbine with such quick shifts?? _________________________ 250 Chevy under tha hood, scratching tha foot
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#44468 - 10/21/08 10:06 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: efi-diy]
Mean buzzen half dozen A.K.A. Hank Mean buzzen half dozen A.K.A. Hank Active BB Member Registered: 09/23/04 Posts: 4585 Loc: Ca	http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=uaPnBWZoqfQ mbhd _________________________ 12 port SDS EFI
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#45054 - 11/10/08 12:40 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Mean buzzen half dozen A.K.A. Hank]
inline300 inline300 Active BB Member Registered: 12/13/04 Posts: 460	tell us the monster is alive
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#45063 - 11/10/08 07:37 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: inline300]
Beater of the Pack Beater of the Pack Active BB Member Registered: 10/06/07 Posts: 2518 Loc: Northern Nevada	Here are some photos of my friend Dan's '64 Chevy pickup with a 4200. I took these in May when he had just got it going. I saw it Saturday but I didn't have my camera. The engine compartment is cleaner and more complete now, ( wiring etc...) He got some help on the wire harness and computer. I haven't got a ride yet, but he is really happy with how strong it is. He says it loves RPMs and ignores the Sierras. His only problem is that he can't get it to warm up without overing 1/2 the radiator. Marc, He wants to know how the Black Opel guys run the distributor. He made major mods to the front cross member to accommodate the pan. My '68 frame is the same. I'm sticking with the 292 for this one, but I'll check the '90 Burb 4X4 frame and see how that would work for a future truck. Beater http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/o_fADdTIthodwtyErjmgTQ?authkey=hizZbWG7Llo _________________________ "I wonder if God created man because he was disappointed in the monkey?" Mark Twain
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#45065 - 11/10/08 09:59 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Beater of the Pack]
efi-diy efi-diy Active BB Member Registered: 11/21/04 Posts: 1392 Loc: Calgary Alberta Canada	Beater, The opel does not use a dist. its running 3 wasted spark coils driven from the MS system without a ignition control box. The ignition is triggered off of a 36-1 timing wheel out of a 92 escort. Rather than mod the cross member I'd modify the oil pan using 2 I5 pans to get a rear sump. My truck is running - not driving it much now - a bit cold without heat. More focused on completing the real turbo motor, which is trying to say the least. Seems murphy has signed onto the engine build team here...@@#$!!@# its a lesson in patience. _________________________ 51 GMC 4.2 turbo Can't solved today's problems using the same technology/thinking that created them
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#45069 - 11/11/08 08:48 AM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: efi-diy]
Beater of the Pack Beater of the Pack Active BB Member Registered: 10/06/07 Posts: 2518 Loc: Northern Nevada	OK, Dan showed me a picture of what he thought was a distributor. Maybe it was and he "thought" it was the Opel. I'm sure it's warmer here but I still don't have enough wood to keep the shop warm. It's though carving an empire out of the wilderness! (and have time left to build hot rods) _________________________ "I wonder if God created man because he was disappointed in the monkey?" Mark Twain
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#45976 - 12/11/08 09:24 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Beater of the Pack]
efi-diy efi-diy Active BB Member Registered: 11/21/04 Posts: 1392 Loc: Calgary Alberta Canada	Quick update to keep the thread alive.. Intake parts installed for a fit check.... I'm going to have to lower the alternator 3/4" to clear the injectors. Edited by efi-diy (12/11/08 09:26 PM) _________________________ 51 GMC 4.2 turbo Can't solved today's problems using the same technology/thinking that created them
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#45980 - 12/11/08 10:50 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: efi-diy]
Nexxussian Nexxussian Active BB Member Registered: 06/12/07 Posts: 1342 Loc: Anchorage	Looks nice. Just so I'm sure what I'm looking at, you only have 2 runners installed, with 4 more to go? _________________________ My, what a steep learning curve. Erik II#5155
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#46006 - 12/12/08 05:36 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Nexxussian]
efi-diy efi-diy Active BB Member Registered: 11/21/04 Posts: 1392 Loc: Calgary Alberta Canada	Correct just 2 runners installed - needed to check firewall clearance. _________________________ 51 GMC 4.2 turbo Can't solved today's problems using the same technology/thinking that created them
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#46016 - 12/13/08 12:01 AM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: efi-diy]
Nexxussian Nexxussian Active BB Member Registered: 06/12/07 Posts: 1342 Loc: Anchorage	Ahhh, yes, firewall clearance 'muy importante'. (don't really know how to spell that, just guessing) _________________________ My, what a steep learning curve. Erik II#5155
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#46033 - 12/13/08 02:36 PM Re: 4200 turbo project... [Re: Nexxussian]
Mean buzzen half dozen A.K.A. Hank Mean buzzen half dozen A.K.A. Hank Active BB Member Registered: 09/23/04 Posts: 4585 Loc: Ca	Is the stock intake really restictive? Made for torque & mid range power? Just curious. MBHD _________________________ 12 port SDS EFI
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