Inliners International Forums General Discussion Bench racing Update Douglas's car w/Sissell/Kirby 12 port head

Don't Turbonetics turbo's have a 1 year warranty? That bite's. Tom

Douglas' turbo:
Warranty Exclusions:
Mid-frame, Y2k and Thumper series turbochargers are intended for extreme duty/race applications and are warranted against defects in material and or workmanship only for a period of 30 days from the date of original invoice.

Was this a brand new turbo?

No idea what could have happen to it?

Steven

This was a new $3000 turbo.

I believe the center section let go,bearings went ,compressor wheel rubbed on compressor housing & possibly the turbine wheel hit also?

MBHD

I don't think Y2K turbos have ported shrouds and it went into surge. This usually breaks a turbo faster than anything.

Harry

He stated before when just running the turbo & breaking it in nicely,the compressor wheel rubbed on the compressor housing,he removed the compressor housing ,slightly opened up the clearance of the compressor wheel where it rubbed.
Lightly sanded/polished the compressor housing.

So might have had a problem from the get go?

I am thinking it was assembled incorrectly. Who knows?


MBHD

So now what is he going to do?

Well, for now he only has the Bulleye turbo, but the A/R is too big. 1.45 T6 huge turbo!

Plus the large amout of overlap w/his cam ,, it does not help with spooling that turbo.

I am pushing Turbonetics to consider some type of deal to help him out.


MBHD

How long before he could have a replacement best case?

If Turbonetics are willing to help out w/Douglas,he could have a turbo in 2 weeks or there abouts.

But Douglas does not have an extra $3000 for another turbo @ the moment.

Does not seem they are willing to help out as of yet,as for now it seems they are sticking to there 30 day warranty deal, even though Douglas had installed it, used it & blew up up in about just 2 weeks.

But Douglas had this turbo lying around his house for a couple months or so,not being used.

I am waiting for them to return my email I sent them,cross your fingers for Douglas.


MBHD

A big turbo on a small engine needs a ported shroud since the turbo flows more air than the engine can use at first. The air then backs up in the intake and tries to turn the compressor wheel backwards, with the turbine spinning in the correct direction the two fight each other and ruin the bearings and scrape the housings. The ported shroud allows the air to recirculate to the intake of the compressor until the engine needs the extra air.

A ball bearing turbo does not ride on the oil wedge as a bushing does, therefore needs to be tighter . Also normally needs less oil flow or will pass oil to the turbine and exhaust. Always feel the play by pushing the wheels to the side of the housing for any rubbing action but don't try to make them hit, every time the turbo is off the engine.

Harry

On rally cars they do not use blow off valves because they do not want to loose any throttle responce.

They run a lot of boost & the compressor is surging during on & off throttle position constantly.
The pressurized air has to go somewhere when the throttle is closed,well it does go somewhere, it goes backwards through the turbochager like my Syclone did before I installed a BOV.

I think Douglas' turbo is a 80 MM compressor wheel, is that considered big?


MBHD

Rally cars use small turbos with a wide surge line for on off acceleration. If they were in constant surge they would not last long.
An 80mm turbo is huge if designed right will make 1400 HP. On a inline six it must have a ported compressor housing, the engines are not that big. The advent of the ported housing is what has allowed big compressors on small engines.
Also the ball bearing turbos do not have as good of oscillation support and will rub easier than a normal bushing style, their strong suit is quick spool up.
Everything is a trade off in motor sports.

Harry

My bad Harry, Douglas' Y2K has an 88 mm inducer,= big.

He took apart the Y2K & the shaft is toast.

His Bullseye turbo has the compressor housing anti surge feature.

He said the Y2K made 15 more psi over his Bullseye turbo during testing of the transbrake.

MBHD

MBHD, Do the Bullseye and Y2K have the same turbine size, and compressor size ?

Harry

The Bullseye compressor wheel is 90 MM inducer 100 MM exducer.

Where as the Turbonetics compressor is 88 MM inducer 90 MM exducer according to Douglas. Need to double check that.

I need to ask about the turbine trim & size.
I am pretty sure the turbine wheels are different from eachother.

The Bullseye turbo is a T6 size turbo, it pretty big in size.

MBHD

Here is Douglas on Speed channel in Brazil.
Pretty cool.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R825adfxyq8&feature=player_embedded

He also got the orange car running,4" std bore & will soon be fuel injected on methanol w/14.6:1 compression.
video here is running on 3 45MM Webers
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsDej7h_kWk


MBHD

Way to go Douglas! Lets see some runs with the red SS. What are the specs for the cam in it? Tom

Great links Hank

That sure is one sweet ride

Thanks for keeping us up on this Hank. That is great coverage for Douglas, and some nice views of the car.

Another update guys.
Taken from his email.
Quote: " Well.... we went to dino to see how the car goes with the new camshaft and no watercooler, and the car shows an impressive power. With only 12 psi, the car made 609 rwhp at 7.300 rpm.
We could not see any number on the dino with REAL PRESSURE, because with 36,4 psi at 8.000 rpm, the car smoke the tires even using VHT on the dino.... That was SCARY!!!!!
On the 2nd pass with 36,4 psi, the car smoked the tires again and the transmission or converter broke.... I will check what happened tonight!! The car is running pure methanol!

On transbreak tests, the car spooled up pretty quick using a lot of timing and lean lambda. 7s to go form idle to 5.400 with 12PSI of boost.

I´m sending the Print of my Fuel Injection datalogger when the car reached 36,4psi of boost on dino. Please note the Back pressure: 34,3psi!!! That was with a Bullseyepower Turbocharger 88mm inducer, 100mm exducer and 1.45 A/R.
We´ll have to choose another dinamometer to read some numbers and tie down the car properly to do not smoke the tires anymore."

MBHD

Another Douglas update but sad

Douglas has blown up the engine.
Basically wiped out everything in the engine,#1 rod broke.
Here was the pass when it broke:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYb16FFszw0
It ran an 8.5 @ 153 MPH, it would have run an 8.0 if it had stayed together.


More sad news, now Douglas has sold this car, so now he will still be racing,just his normally aspirated car
I believe here are the numbers below:

LUIZCARNIELSIX | May 30, 2010
OPALA Douglas Carbonera 00,239 / 1,339 / 3,716 / 05,545 / 07,062 / 08,586 - 2...


MBHD

Bummer.

blowen up is kinda a understatement.The motor looks more like it was hit with a shredder.But i do feel sorry for him after all that hard work time & money that went into it all.