Inliners International Forums General Discussion Engines 230 -> 250 upgrade - can i stage it?

Hi,

It's time for me to either start investing in the L230 in the '67 Camaro or punt for a brand new v8. I like the idea of saving a few thousand and fewer things to turn into a PIA when upgrading the original engine. It's original numbers, I think. I'll validate. I'm just about done with the brake, power steering, suspension upgrades. Complication is the new springs were probably made for the heavier V8, car sits high in front, crud.

The carburetor is pretty much shot. Even after the rebuild last year, there's still a drip of gas down the throat. Choke sticks sometimes too. Blows a lot of black smoke out the back this season (just started getting it on the road this past week). Stalls at idle. But haven't started diagnosis yet, need working brakes first.

I was thinking the thing to do is this fall after the rains begin is to yank the engine, convert it to a 250, put on a nice ported head, a moderate CAM, offy & 4 bbl Holley, Langdon headers. The cost of such an upgrade is getting up there, I was thinking about staging.

The carb is forcing the issue now. It seems another painful step to do the offy intake with the stock exhaust manifold, but that means I don't need to upgrade the exhaust and intake heater right now.

Thoughts on just intake and carb upgrade? How hard is it to put in an exhaust system? I really like the buy new and bolt it in approach (no time to dink around).

What do you think about performance improvements?

1) Stock: 130HP
2) Current: probably <100HP, at least that's how it feels.
3) offy intake, header, carb
4) +lump port head
5) 250 upgrade with moderate CAM?

Thanks,
Mark

The V8 swap is likely cheaper and simpler and offers much more options and more power and torque. Don't think building a straight six up (the right way)is cheap. Its not. Its more rewarding.

Here's what I would do. Go buy a rebuildable 250 and have these done to it. Block work:
.040 over bore
307 V8 flat top pistons
Comp Cams Ultra Pro Magnum 268 duration 219 @ .050 .486 lift on a 110 lobe center.
Have the block zero decked and everything balanced.
Head work:
Lump ports
1.94 intake valves and 1.60 exhaust valves.
Might shave the head to.
Roller rockers and a slightly bigger set of valve springs...all this should add up to 300 horse and 280 torque with a good Holley or edelbrock and headers. Keeping the 6 is very rewarding and a fun journey...there's always the option of a turbo to. That 6 and a good tremic 5 speed will be sweet.

I concur, since TJ basically described my 250 to a T, except I have 1.84 intake and 1.60 exhaust valves. Having a 550hp small-block AND now a newly running 275ish hp inline 6, I can say that the small-block is badass and sounds great, and it got my Camaro knocking on the 10 second range on pump gas and in street trim. However, after getting my 250 running recently, and hearing that thing idle and rev, it's going to be a peppy little thing too, and should have a unique sound that's going to have the regular V8 crowd raise a brow when I'm flogging it. It's all about what you really want, cheaper but sufficient V8 power, or the slightly more expensive hopped up inliner that's a little less powerful than the V8, but one that's gonna be different than most everything else at the local cruise in.

My new 292 was more expensive than a 290/350 but EVERYONE has a stinkin 350 that it sick anymore and heck...my new 292 will eat up a 290/350 and I'll be laughing doing it to. lol Now a 330/350 will be more of a challenge and would slowly leave me, but add 8 pounds of boost to my 292 and I'll be taking on 400 small blocks with ease...until the explosion.

Alrighty you hot rodders out there, how fast is your car?

I ran four trials of 0-60MPH on a pretty much flat road. Nothing really scientific here, considering my speedometer reads 55 when it's really 60. With the power glide, it ran 1st gear to about 53MPH before shifting. Those last 7MPH are the longest MPH with nearly no acceleration.

You ready?

Sure? It'll knock your socks off (laughing).

Averaged: 25.2 seconds

I added a wire to manually turn off the choke under the hood, makes a huge difference, runs much better. The gas gauge seemed to drop pretty quickly during this test too.

I still don't like the bit of drag on the front brakes, but they don't seem to get hot anymore, so that's not a problem.

How fast do you think a stock 230 should be? What about if I just add the lump ported head, offy intake, and headers?




That sounds pretty awesome TJ!

A turn-key v8 335HP from chevy with complete accessories runs about $4600, call it $6500 with tax and the inevitable other stuff. Oh yeah, there's 10% tax on everything here. Tempting yes. But if you go this route, it should really be an LS, which will drive the cost up to $8K-$9K total. The wife says I could have bought one of those shiny new Camaros off the lot. I lucked out and got one as a rental car in Austin last year. Wow, talk about gitty-up! Second fastest car I've ever driven. Fastest was a test drive of a Tesla (0-60 6+seconds). In 20 years, we'll all be talking about our electric upgrades... But I digress...

I can have this L6 fully rebuilt for probably $4500 with everything. A head and the fixings is probably just above $2000. I wouldn't want to change to another block because it's original numbers. I can swap a head myself, at least I've done it before in my youth. :-) But I notice I seem to cuss more than I did in my youth when I whack myself too, less patience I guess...

My moms stock 1973 4 dr 250 3:08 gears PG Nova ran 21 seconds in the 1/4 3000 ft altitude track.
I believed it weighed 3400 LBS no driver.

Advanced the timing, (more than stock) ran in the 19 second range.

Ran it with 5 friends in the car, same track & time, still, 19 second range.

The PG trans just kills it for trying to accelerate.

MBHD

Sounds pretty similar, 230 instead of 250. Some good torque to pull you and your buddies crammed in the car. I'm sure it was a fun drive, even if not that quick.

A 4-speed OD such as 200R4 would be pretty good in this car, except it might decelerate when in OD. LOL.

Mark